The future of Chat

"Chat" has been one of the most controversial and ambiguous topics for a very long time. It still is, and I would like to bring up the Chat topic for discussion, mostly in conceptual sense. 

The very definition of what Chat is exactly is getting more and more blurry. Major social networks offer different takes on group discussions - either extending their Messenger or their Mailbox features. Some sites still focus on old-style IRC-like dedicated chat, with rooms, moderators, etc. 

What's you take? What is your vision of the ideal Chat of tomorrow?

Mobile chat.

possible features:-

• kick with time limit ability
• ban option with time limit
• age restriction option on rooms
• main area showing rooms list which can be entered rather than rooms within main lobby like currently
• flood control
• character limit control
• user options within in chat like 'view profile' to open in new tab
• Option for users to auto approve or not their cam access
  
  

skins / options to personalize chat rooms would be good also I think ...

I like chat rooms the way they can be with 123FlashChat and FlashComs but I see flash is not wanted by many Dolphin webmasters ... I do think the way they look, work and their admin controls is really good and effective ...

It would properly be good to maybe have similar kind of thing but not flash based.

 This all sounds good to me.

Take a little look at this Chat Script, has some good features, and No Flash, but its not Free of course.

http://www.photonchat.com/index.php

What Detective said in the first post! I have been waiting on WebRTC but it's not in prime time yet. Presently, I dig Codologic's Freichat concept and features along with responsive for mobile/tablet, the ability to send file(s) and smiley. I think animated ones are more fun.

 +1 on the Codologic Chat, very very nice.

no more flash...  java... ajax...   pure html5 would be nice with the option of video streaming still of course. (thinking mobile/facetime like) 

Pretty sure red5 supports html5...

I like it the way it is now with the separate features of the 3 styles of chat we have now.  

Try and fix how rayz functions work in the code for those that DO NOT use chat at all.  There is no need to call all of that java script and functions if it's not being used. (and there is a lot of it)

Just right click and view source on any page and you will see all the rayz calls at the top...  

Add a check box in admin some place to turn each rayz (or new chat) function on or off completely.

Run one simple query to check if the chat features are on or off in the DB then take it from there on what to do next... 

Then add every function possible in the settings block (admin side) that one would want or need from color changes, room creation by age, sex , location...  what ever the case me be based on profile information.

user side:  keep track of my font size, color, style, type..  track who i banned or blocked from contacting me.

Remove the popup that asks to start video or audio stream.  This is a problem for some mac users anyway.  I already clicked the button to start the stream no need to reconfirm it.  Although i see chrome is now popping up the question again at the top of the browser to allow or deny use of the web cam.

The ability to record chat sessions if i want to. (admin only here) text and video  Thinking for classrooms or meeting archive here.   integrated whiteboard would be nice here as well inside the chat room.

also the ability to share my desktop instead of video stream would be nice.

Just figure at this point if you are going to redo it and it could be years until the next time, you might as well make it appeal to adult, social, community, and business sites.  You never know what the market is going to change to next...   just add it all in there now and be done with it so it matches all the default modules dolphin offers. 

I am sure there is a bunch more i am just not thinking straight (1:30am)  

Codologic looks interesting, not seen that one!

Main request for me would be iphone friendly.

No point having anything on a site these days that does not work with all mobile devices....

HTML5 Websockets is the way to go ...

go look at what flashcoms sales, that is what everyone wants

you could charge your prices if you included a chat like flashcoms sales and not one person would complain

I think we definately need to step away from flash chat. A more stable system is required... I can not count the amount of times my rooms all dissapeared completely... They were still in the DB, but just wouldnt show on chat...

My ideal system would show all rooms clearly, and how many were in each room (a block for the home page with this info would also be nice). Also, a list that showed which rooms your friends were in with a "quick join" button. 

How about ab FB chat inviter.... If I am in chat and someone I know is on FB I can invite them to come and chat on the site by sending a chat invite???? Age limiter is very important... I also used to like AOL chat where you could just drop and audio file or type the name of an audio file into the chat and it would play on everyones PC that was in the room... It was an awsome feature. The rooms definately need to be skinable.

I hope not automatically. Ugh!

I agree ... I like the simple messenger and video messenger ..... the main chat room however needs BIG improvements!

I have suggested in 'possible features' that would make a huge difference in itself...

One thing I don't like with current main chat room is the 'ban system' ... the other week I was looking in my DB and I realized that my moderators had banned 300+ chat room users and I didn't have a clue! In my eyes this was over 300 users that should have been able to access chat again after given time but instead was basically lost and not enjoying my site until I realized how many people had actually been banned.

keep it simple, no flash just improve the simple messenger module, (fb has a good one)

This is a tough one.

It's going to be impossible to please everyone.

Some will want voice and video, others will not.

Some want to ditch flash. Others will want to keep it.

Some will want HTML5 not realizing that HTML5 is not standardized enough yet and Microsoft will slow down it's adoption for years. The pricks always interfere.

What ever is done, some will love it, others will hate it.

HTML5 isn't officially released yet LOL  I think it is planned for Q4 of 2014.

So long as it works on iphones, Im not bothered what code it is. 

Chat rooms, ability for certain membership levels to create them would be good.

Video chat as an admin controlled option, peer to peer streaming.

Wow! Not as straightforward as it may seem, huh!?

So far, I gather that we are looking for a no-Flash solution that works on mobiles seamlessly, but still has rooms, moderators, smileys and such. HTML5 is cool, but we should stick to the most adopted bits only. Audio/video is still required, but due to reliance on either Flash or "fresh" technologies those it has to be implemented as an "add-on" feature. 

Extensive moderation tools are required, but can be limited to desktop-version only. After all moderators are likely to be at the desk when on duty. 

All in all it's clear and we have some ideas that shouldn't take long to develop into the first builds. Stay in touch!

(Sorry for delayed responses these days - big storms blew out Internet in our town and it's still hectic. Aussie weather is a bitch.)

 I used to have the same issue when I was connecting to a shared RMS. Once I got RMS installed on my own server, it never happened again.

The best solution is to offer both Flash and HTML5 so that your customers can choose the implementation that is best suited to their application of Dolphin.  Address the issues with the Flash version and create a HTML5 version; choice is good, limitations are bad.

Flash should only be used for audio/video at most - having a large Flash client doesn't make sense these days. An Ajax client (a more advanced version of the simple messenger) sounds nice.

a feature in from the Chat module that will generate fake people that are chatting to get users involved. 

For the new chatroom I will need at least 40 chatters currently in 1 room at ALL time.

 Not a good idea, I have seen members comment on my chat rooms auto poster, thinking my responses were also "fake" immediately running users off.

Considered the same as the auto profile, auto online modules we have.

Never liked the fake profiles way. This bites you back and here in Australia we actually had a big dating site successfully sued for this. The day you charge for anything on your site - all the pretend stuff is a liability. With Chat, I suppose a real operator sitting there and greeting people would be the way. 

With Chat, I suppose a real operator sitting there and greeting people would be the way. 

True, because flashchat offers the auto attendant somewhat but confused members because they thought it was a live person; when trying to respond, nothing happened, so another person not coming back.

This is not usually the case if the chat room has users.

Andrew are you able to give an idea of time frame for new chat ?

I don't know if it's just me but I installed a fresh site with chat and the chat appears to work even worse that on older Dolphin versions!

I have used skype for years, and it it ok, but then I started using Raidcall. It is simple and I like that you have the option of choosing "Push to talk" or an open mic, so that would be an option that I would like. Also, I would love for the chat to pop out of the main page so that a user can still continue to browse the site.

I have noticed on new install that settings that do work on my other sites are not really working at all now ... settings set for guest don't work for example:

guest is not allowed to Private chat or try and view cams >>> they try and private chat and it's rejected BUT the persons cam still shows even though it's not allowed ...

ALSO, if guest are allowed to use cams and audio the chat does not allow then even though settings have been set to allow :/

Will the chat have real time comments? Or would users have to constantly refresh/repress the f5 button off their keyboards to keep up?

A chat without real time would be pointless.  What I want to know is if Rayz was telling me the truth that if I install RMS, the double posting in the chat room will stop.

Have there been any advances on making the chat room function without flash? 

Am I correct in thinking that the ONLY way to access the chat room is via a PC? It doesn't seem to work on my Android phone nor on an iPad.

Chat and Messenger (not Simple Messenger) use Flash - they are Flash apps. iOS never supported Flash, and Adobe dropped support for Flash on Android after 4.0. So unless this is a rather old Android device, indeed, it's desktop only.

I think everything with boonex that has anything to do with video, webcams, chat, comments, messaging, video, pictures, etc. should be in real time and should use the member's internet connection so no bandwidth is used by the website owner and should all be mobile and responsive with super high HD quality

+1 for WebRTC and Websockets for text chat. Kill the flash chat with fire.

 When I first encountered Dolphin, I thought the video chat  feature was the coolest thing about the software.  That's a pretty good testament as to how naive I was about what grownups want to do on a web site.   These days, I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that over 90% of chat room users are either in middle school or creepers preying on them.  The other 10% of chat room users are on sleazy porn sites and the rooms are likely filled creepy  perverts that are incapable of any type of normal social interaction in the real world.... so they withdraw to their virtual world.  I've operated a number of sites that included a chat room, and I can say with 100% certainty, that chat rooms have ZERO appeal to your average, mentally healthy grownup.  If you are a porn site wannabe, or would like to have a site infested with immature teenagers and sleazy slimy creeps.... then chat rooms are for you. 

For those that are building niche sites for responsible, well adjusted adults, chat rooms are essentially useless.  That audience uses email, cell phones, and occasional text messages, and that's enough. 

Andrew, if you really want to come up with something that will truly have an impact on the success of Dolphin sites, start thinking about how to put together a team of coders that can provide custom Dolphin modules for people at a fair price in a timely manner.  Most purveyors of Dolphin modules on this site, either have no interest in custom work, or are too busy cranking out boring Dolphin add-ons that do nothing to get me excited.  I have at least one site that is dead in the water because I cannot find anyone familiar with Dolphin to take on a complex, yet straightforward coding project.  Sure.... if you post an ad somewhere, you'll get responses from some complete stranger halfway around the world, but who in their right mind want's to do business that way?  Surely you folks at Boonex have been around long enough, and know enough people, to put together some sort of custom solutions team.  We each need something to set our site apart from the other 800,000 Dolphin sites.  Facebook has social networking locked up, match.com and a few others have dating sites locked up, linkedin has a lock on business networking, etc.  It is foolish and naive to believe for a minute that you can compete with mega sites like those.  I have yet to see a successful Dolphin site, and the lack of access to custom coding is a big reason why.  Yeah I know, once in a while people around here like to blow their horn about their "succesful" Dolphin site with 20,000 members.  To me, that's like bragging to Sam Walton about how successful your booth at the flea market is. 

For any Dolphin site to ever be truly successful, there needs to be a level of unique customization that is currently unattainable by any means currently available through boonex.com 

Think about it.

I have to agree and disagree ...

1) the chat rooms need major revamp... agreed

2) The bit I don't really agree on is about the types of users that are happy to use current Dolphin chat! My main site only really attracts middle aged + users (teenagers too but mainly used by mature adults) who enjoy getting away from sleazy chat rooms and not interested in adult sites. They are not put off by the current set-up and continue to come back hour after hour and day after day! My site is like PG rated compared to other chat rooms.

I think when people are mislead about someone's site chat room and, or there are very little users actively online ... this is what puts people off from coming back and using them.

Saying this I don't have the busiest chat room by any means but I know my users have happily leave very popular sites like webcamnow, ivideochat and similar sites because they did not like the atmosphere or abuse between members and yet these chat rooms softwares are FAR better

I agree with where HL is coming from. On our project, we asked a bunch of persons in our industry, and they all said that chat rooms are for perverts or little kids and that they would never waste their time on an open chat room.

Now, with that being said, the video messenger could be way more useful if it were non-flash based and allowed for a user on a mobile device to video chat with their front-facing camera on that mobile device. (not referring to the mobile site). So, for a most pressing issue with the chat - start with the video messenger.

Yeah some of my members have actually said they first assumed my chat room would be the same as others they have been on ... they was pleasantly surprised and stick around knowing we are different! Those that do come to my site for the wrong reasons promptly leave after realizing we are not adult chat etc so for my own situation and what I am looking to achieve it's win win

I believe Chat still potential for bright future, but not so much as a standalone destination. I see Chat more as a "quick talk" platform, which may be either between just two people or a few. Number if people, video/audio, pictures, length of messages - these are all just attributes of conversation. Forums/blogs serve as a platform for public conversation and Messages/Chat/younameit could serve as a platform for private conversation. It may then be either a feature of some other modules (like comments for Notes or Photos, like Forums for Groups, etc) and/or the IM-plugin for the entire site.

This turned topics turned out to be very very helpful and useful.  

I agree about the 'quick talk' platform part but what about networks like mine that regularly have far more than a few people chatting and using cams at anyone time?

Should I be looking at alternative chat services or will / can Boonex ensure the 'future chat' will not only be better but be able to handle greater numbers without issue like other chat software out there?

 RE:

 I won't say you're alone in that belief, but you'll find it pretty hard to find others  to share that belief.  Please don't spend time on something that is fading into oblivion.  There are far more important things to ponder over than how middle school children and pedophiles pass their time.  Chat functionality is covered well enough by third party Dolphin addons for dolphin site owners that are stuck in the 1990's. 

 What I am talking about is function, not capacity. We should be able to come up with solution that works well for 2 or for 2000 participants. Let's see how it goes.

Well what happens when someone have 2001 users chatting?  Upgrade to a pro (paid) version?

I believe the function aspect of it should also include (unlimited) capacity.  Its the same thing with pictures, videos, files, forum, audio, blogs, ect., part of their functions isn't limited by capacity.

Great, I like many others look forward to seeing the new Dolphin chat :)

It will be AWESOME to see Boonex / Dolphin with it's own solid chat setup rather than some third party chat integrated into Dolphin in my own view ..

Currently, my site has 5051 members and from the start of my site till now, nearly 11,000 members have passed through the door.

Yes my site is a niche site and the chat room does get used, but far less now because the majority of my members are using their iPhone, Android phone or iPad or Android tablet to access the site. That means there are lots of people having issues joining and using my site. 

Chances are that they are moving on to other sites with better functionality.

My members do like to use the chat room. In support of what HL said earlier about chat rooms, the conversation always starts off well enough but always sinks down conversation-wise lower than a snails ball-sack. People can't help themselves. Either way, I would rather my members have the ability to choose whether or not they want to use the chat room and not have that choice taken away from them because Boonex can't create a solution.

It wouldn't be so bad if they could really get some mileage out of the app, but the app I am afraid to say is crapp (I put two p's there on purpose).

You guys have a great product but it lacks the breadth and width of functionality of many other sites.

As it stands now, I might as well shut down the chat room till you can come up with an HTML5 alternative.

I have been using Dolphin since the days of long ago and would like to continue to use it but SOMETHING needs to be done about the mobile market.

Let me take a different stance for a minute, and create a hybrid topic.  Rayz, number two on the Trusted vendor list, has made no improvements whatsoever to the chat system in all the years I've been year.  He's got plenty of time to work on paid addons and extensions, but could never be bothered to update the flash source so it could be used with present day flash IDEs.  You guys couldn't even be bothered to make the flash app xml skinnable.

Why the sudden interest in chat Andrew after completely ignoring it for the last decade?

 Oh, I used "2000" as an example, not a limit. We do not have any plans to limit anything, since it wouldn't be a Boonex-powered service, but rather your own hosted software. 

 Well, the time has come, I guess. This year mobile devices are taking over desktop and there's no turning back. We also need a new chat solution that's future-proof and that would work as a messenger as well. It's one of the next big features on the table - right after some smaller fix-ups and updates.