Collaborate | Resale | Recycle | ReBuild a Trusting Community
RecycledMods carbon footprint efforts.
Developers, hear this out, before you strike at this. I am looking at the initial requirements on the possibility of recycling modules that have been purchased and for whatever reason, are not being used, or dont work in their specific scope.
So here is the and rough draft developers, so your input on this is crucial. UnityMember purchases modX from Developer1, the mod is determined unusable, and UnityMember would like to recoup some of the expenditure for the modules that are not being used. Developers in reviewing the request for Recycling, your reward for that would be a % of the Recycle Fee, we wont call this a sales fee, but a recycle fee. Developers, this does in essence direct more traffic and clients to you, if purchased on a recycled instance or purchased from the unity market. All things considering, there is no real garauntee that the modules will actually Recycle, so we would set a time period in which they would have a LifeCycle. Each time the module is resubmitted,. the developer will receive the Processing fee for reviewing the required documents. These fees are paid up front pre-sale.
This is about honesty, integrity, Unity, and I for one, can see this as being something great. The verbiage itself makes some cringe, but if there is a controlled environment, with agreements on both sides, and compensation for participating in the Recycled Mods Program, what could it hurt to give it a try?
I have thought about this, and there is a way to do this that all involved are satisfied and protected. of course this would take collaboration from the developers, and honesty from the unity members.
memberA has purchased moduleZ from developer1
member uses a third party resouce, to submit the resale of a copyrighted work. the document would include such things as purchase date, Transaction ID from payment, reason for cause to sale
review of mod developer (support, responsiveness ....), review of the product (did you install it, did you pay somebody to install it, if you installed what was the level of dificulty)
third party would review the application, and collaborate with the mod developer, if mod developer is in agreement, that memberA is the original owner of the module, and agrees to allow resale of the said product: third party resource would allow the module to be uploaded,(collaborate)
license key would be applied, and product would be provided with on the market for download, with a qty 1, so once the module was resold, then it would remove itself from the market.
as a courtesy, the third party resource provider, would make every effort to install the module, the module must comply with the latest standards of the modular system of dolphin. the license would call back on --> Domain | IP |Directory, one or a combination of all three or any
memberA would submit an testament, that all iterations of the resold module have been destroyed, from local drive and server. all backups of the module if any have also been removed. (trust factor). if memberA is found to be dishonest, in regards to destroying the modules, then it would be advertised to all current developers and future developers, that memberA has a bit of an issue with following through on collaboration agreements.
it would be the position that in order for this to work, there would be one central repository for acquiring resold modules.
im sure this could be built-upon, and
could possibly be operated by recycledmods.com
feedback thoughts
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
What about feedback and reviews to the module? multiple reviews on one purchase ok? |
It'll take heavy moderation but I don't see why it couldnt' work.
I know this is a whole different concept but if the site takes off you might have a section for new mods also and charge a small percent per sale, for the devopers who can't afford to pay the fee to sell mods here.
BoonEx Certified Host: Zarconia.net - Fully Supported Shared and Dedicated for Dolphin |
What about feedback and reviews to the module? multiple reviews on one purchase ok?
not so much, because one user would only have one product, and part of the requirement for recycling the product is that the original purchaser provide feedback on the product. so there would not be multiple feedbacks on that product, if you have 200 unity members recycling the same module, or attempting to recycle the same module, then that would signal consideration of the module itself.
the recycling of hte module is intended for one who has purchased a mdule only later to find that the module is not what they were needing, but the only want to realize that was to spend the money. now after thousands have been spent in most cases, short of causing grief for the mod developer, it is being requested that they be allowed to recycle the module back into the community through collaborative efforts with the module developer, and by providing a mechanism in which the recycled module is license protected so that it is not illegally distributed.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
well when i first started dabbling with the licensing of the modules, i had contacted a few guys, and let them know my intent.
i plan on expanding this to a full blown market, where the developers would upload their works, the works would be licensed , full tracking and affiliate system for their works. needless to say, that comes with a nice price tag, and one i couldnt absorb by myself.
there is not really any moderation, if you ask me. there is an application which is submitted, the application is reviewed, for completeness, the application is forwarded to the mod developer, the mod developer replies yes | no this is the original purchaser.
unity member states requested price, % then submnitted for mod developer.
not really much interaction or moderation, besides, im sure you are always avialable for extra work
It'll take heavy moderation but I don't see why it couldnt' work.
I know this is a whole different concept but if the site takes off you might have a section for new mods also and charge a small percent per sale, for the devopers who can't afford to pay the fee to sell mods here.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
I think once you take on new mods, you'll have to pick a new name.  BoonEx Certified Host: Zarconia.net - Fully Supported Shared and Dedicated for Dolphin |
I'm sure that I can find a few mods that I'm not using or are out of phase. Ex: I bought a mod about a yr and a half ago I had it updated once and then it was no longer useful after an upgrade and I would love the chance to get that back up and running.......it was like a myspace layout where members could choose backgrounds and stuff like that. |
in a case such as that, it would be beneficial to contact the mod developer, and inquire about upgrading the module. also, you should always make sure you capture the modules description on the market. as the product may be pulled and then you are uncertain if you were due free upgrades. if you are due free upgrades and the developer is still alive and not providing the upgrades, then i would think a refund would be in order.
I'm sure that I can find a few mods that I'm not using or are out of phase. Ex: I bought a mod about a yr and a half ago I had it updated once and then it was no longer useful after an upgrade and I would love the chance to get that back up and running.......it was like a myspace layout where members could choose backgrounds and stuff like that.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
It's a topic that needs to be 'figured out' no matter if for or against, as it is not going to go away!
The more customers start to dload Dolphin, the more demand for modules there will be.
Some will always purchase modules in respect of the work that goes into them (I myself have purchased multiple repeat modules from some developers)
Some will look for a way to re-coup unused (I have spent thousands on modules in 2 years, and only half turn out to be useful to me)
Some will just not care and will look for free or cheap.
This is a problem that the games industry has started to change recently after developers would sell once, then game shops or 3rd party sites would re-sell multiple times. The developer gets the first cut, but with rising prices and falling incomes, most buyers only have to wait a week and they can pick up a 2nd hand (as new) game for much cheaper.
So, what has happened with games, is the developers put in a safety guard against this.
On first purchase, you get the game disc, plus a 1 time use serial number that has to be typed in to unlock either the online side of the game, or further content.
They also provide a way to purchase further serial numbers if you dont have one.
This means that those who will still pay first, the developer still gets their high premium 1st payment.
Those that will buy 2nd hand, have to pay something to developer to get full use of game.
I think this has legs with modules...
If developers focused on updates more (some do) and provided new 'content' or functions to mods with regular updates, and in order to apply the update you had to input a 'license number' of some sort, then developers could sell license numbers individually.
This would have to be done in a way that if you purchased the original mod, you have some sort of different user specific license that enables free updates.
I know you could then argue that this could encourage people just to get the mod for free and then just buy a license for cheaper, but I dont think it would as much as it would attract more 2nd hand buyers to actually pay the developer 'something' for the update license.
Of course, developers would also then have to make sure the updates were worth paying for!
I do think that more and more people will be dloading dolphin, and you will get more people wanting to find a 'cheaper' way to get mods, so you have to offer some sort of 2nd price tier for this market.
Its a fact that the majority of people who would for instance - use a torrent site for dloading pirate videos, would never purchase those videos outright in the first place. They are NOT a lost sale.
I know this as my previous business was running an online media company which developed and sold video content online (sports industry).
I could have a major release of a sporting event on video, and have over 500 torrent dloads within the first few hours of a DVD being delivered to the first handful of customers.
Piracy in whatever form, cannot be prevented. You have to be creative with how you best benefit from it as a developer...
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I'm always looking for a 3rd, 4th and 5th job. If you need someone every Tuesday from 3pm to 3:15pm let me know. Kidding, count me in.
not really much interaction or moderation, besides, im sure you are always avialable for extra work
BoonEx Certified Host: Zarconia.net - Fully Supported Shared and Dedicated for Dolphin |
I think it is a sound concept, especialy until the developers learn to colaborate on what they are doing in the market.
Its the developers that would probably benefit in the end becaus I for one would take the re-cycled finance and spend it on my site, which would mean more mod purchases and custom work. There are lots of things I need right now, but I cant afford them, but i do have £1000 of mods that I cant use.
Also, I have complete custom modules that I have had built from the groud up. The code for these belongs to my company, and it cost me big bucks. I cant support the products because I dont have the know how, but if I could find support then the products could be entered into the market and sold on.
At then end of the day, I do think this will be shot down. I hope not.
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Let me state publicly before this idea gets much traction that I am totally against this concept and will not be a part of it. The bottom line is, no matter how you try to polish it off, once you give others the right to resell your products, developers are going to end up getting screwed over. I have had multiple clients who purchased a product then return to say "Sorry I should have purchased product B instead of product A as it fits the need of my site better" and six months later when I check their main site (or other sites they own), I see both modules in use. Depending on people's honesty is a difficult thing to do in the internet world. Not all clients who purchase products will expose their site details. There is really no way to track and verify if the module is destroyed after recycling. Paypal email is jeromemingo@gmail.com - http://www.boonex.com/market/posts/modzzz |
I vote also for this idea. Unfortumnately Im 100%m sure 99% of developers will be against :-( |
nice post, going to respond and highlight inline
It's a topic that needs to be 'figured out' no matter if for or against, as it is not going to go away! i believe it should be addressed, and get it settled. though you cant truly compare tangible and intangible, the method in which the modules are purchased from the market provides no grace period for demo'ing the module. and you cant really count on "well i had it available as a demo on siteX" knowing full well that from one customization to the next, modules behave differently.
The more customers start to dload Dolphin, the more demand for modules there will be. there have been times when dolphin was in a huge upswing of use, that these developers were not able to keep up, and if dolphin does anything notable with Dolphin 8, we are surely to experience the same type of behavior. one developer can create a module, one developer can support a handful of module users, every dolphin site is different, and with that,
Some will always purchase modules in respect of the work that goes into them (I myself have purchased multiple repeat modules from some developers)
and that is the respect they deserve, though i couldnt perceive having four or five of the same module on the Recycle Program, one instance of any module submitted
Some will look for a way to re-coup unused (I have spent thousands on modules in 2 years, and only half turn out to be useful to me)
well are they defunct because they dont work, or from some customization that created an incompatibility issue
Some will just not care and will look for free or cheap.
rogues, and crooks, there have been plenty of those around here. they have for the most part been weeded out. there there are still quite a few, i think it was mentioned where they will sell a bundle pack of modules and have never purchased the first one.
This is a problem that the games industry has started to change recently after developers would sell once, then game shops or 3rd party sites would re-sell multiple times. The developer gets the first cut, but with rising prices and falling incomes, most buyers only have to wait a week and they can pick up a 2nd hand (as new) game for much cheaper.
So, what has happened with games, is the developers put in a safety guard against this.
On first purchase, you get the game disc, plus a 1 time use serial number that has to be typed in to unlock either the online side of the game, or further content.
They also provide a way to purchase further serial numbers if you dont have one.
This means that those who will still pay first, the developer still gets their high premium 1st payment.
Those that will buy 2nd hand, have to pay something to developer to get full use of game.
I think this has legs with modules...
If developers focused on updates more (some do) and provided new 'content' or functions to mods with regular updates, and in order to apply the update you had to input a 'license number' of some sort, then developers could sell license numbers individually.
This would have to be done in a way that if you purchased the original mod, you have some sort of different user specific license that enables free updates.
the method in which i am suggesting the licensing take place is much like what you reference, though its part of the file structure, and those files would pretty much stay intact throughout upgrades. one file has the license number, one file checks to see if the license number is on the directory structure or database. to avoid the issue we have seen in the past with callback(), there is no failure on the license should the server lose communication, thus utilizing a cached authentication, which is dynamically generated each time the callback() is verified.
I know you could then argue that this could encourage people just to get the mod for free and then just buy a license for cheaper, but I dont think it would as much as it would attract more 2nd hand buyers to actually pay the developer 'something' for the update license.
well here is where i have suggested the checks and balance system, if siteowner1 is lacking the correct documentation Transaction ID, and such that goes along with purchasing the modules originally, and there has been no collaboration with RecycleMods, then that person is in possession of stolen property
Of course, developers would also then have to make sure the updates were worth paying for!
most all developers provide free updates, there are a few who are not at that level yet, but the majority of the module developers here provide free or reduced upgrades on their work.
I do think that more and more people will be dloading dolphin, and you will get more people wanting to find a 'cheaper' way to get mods, so you have to offer some sort of 2nd price tier for this market.
my suggestion involved outside the market, managed between mod developer | mod purchaser | RecycleMods
Its a fact that the majority of people who would for instance - use a torrent site for dloading pirate videos, would never purchase those videos outright in the first place. They are NOT a lost sale.
I know this as my previous business was running an online media company which developed and sold video content online (sports industry).
I could have a major release of a sporting event on video, and have over 500 torrent dloads within the first few hours of a DVD being delivered to the first handful of customers.
Piracy in whatever form, cannot be prevented. You have to be creative with how you best benefit from it as a developer...
and i think that is what could be accomplished here, is the collaboration of the mod developer, the module owner, and RecycleMod.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
Problem is, for or against, the issue will not go away.
People will always re-sell or give away modules, as with anything else that delivered online.
What if the emphasis was not on allowing 're-selling' of modules, but on somehow getting those who have 'found' the module not via unity, to part with some money in order to use the upgrade service for that module? The license key idea I suggested earlier could work for this?
What if out of 1000 Dolphin users,
100 purchase a mod direct
900 get it some other way.
100 - would have purchased the upgrade rights along with the mod via the developer
the developer then hopes that the other 90% will be forced to purchase the original in order to upgrade. Unfortunately, by this time they already have the mod and will not be keen to pay for what they think they already own (especially if they have paid something for it elsewhere...)
Surely, it would benefit the developer to tap into that 900 by offering some sort of service where they can purchase support?
Maybe it would take 2 version of the mod. Premium which would be license locked by the develop and therefore only available to direct buyers, and a light version which could be part functional but have hardcoded links back to the developer, as well as being encrypted maybe to protect the links?
The result could be that a % of the 900 could end up paying to upgrade to the original, while the 'other' versions that are not license locked act as free advertising for the developer with sales links back to unity...
As I said, for or against, the issue will only grow as more people start using Dolphin...
One other thing, it would be good if there was a discount available to multiple buyers!!!
I have purchased some mods 5 times each to run on different sites, some developers will give a small discount on repeat purchase if asked, whereas others just ignore any request for discount!
Good customers should be rewarded, good developers gain good customers!
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Much thought has gone into this recycling idea. After weighing pros and cons.
I agree with Modzzz . I see more problems with this than benefits. This is the mod creators income that will be affected. I think what we pay for our mods now is excellent considering if you asked an outsider programmer to create a mod the price would be multiple times more in cost.
The biggest problem with this is the mods are copyable so this creates endless problems an if you give them permission to resell can only end badly.
Another concern though is the problems this is capable of causing is not worth the time effort or % of the $ the mod creators will get.
I am not a mod creator but I know I am flat out with my site and do not have a minute to spare each day. Sure be great if I could get a few bucks for my mods I don't use.
But what happens then I recycle a mod, and a user purchases it,., then the next version of dolphin comes up and the person who bought my recycled mod upgrades then bitch and complain that the mod no longer works. I just don't have time to listen to people complain to me when I have enough things now to worry about. This is a drama waiting to be born.
Count me out. ....
Let me state publicly before this idea gets much traction that I am totally against this concept and will not be a part of it. The bottom line is, no matter how you try to polish it off, once you give others the right to resell your products, developers are going to end up getting screwed over. I have had multiple clients who purchased a product then return to say "Sorry I should have purchased product B instead of product A as it fits the need of my site better" and six months later when I check their main site (or other sites they own), I see both modules in use. Depending on people's honesty is a difficult thing to do in the internet world. Not all clients who purchase products will expose their site details. There is really no way to track and verify if the module is destroyed after recycling.
Jennifer Bogan .. Acc. Dip. Psychology - EMAIL: jennifer.bogan@gmail.com |
jerome,
this is not authorizing them to resell your mods. there would be a one module limit, you would have to confirm they were the original purchaser with verifiable Transaction IDs in order to offer the single product to Recycle, they would not be allowed, to bring the same product, because of course you would have known that it has been recycled once.
I wish you would read what is involved here. The one entity would control the collaboration between the mod developer, and the submitter of the module.
think about this, jerome, if you were able to receive reparation for recycling the module, rather than receive nothing, because people get fed up with having those modules, and for whatever reason, the modules are of no use, either from lack of functionality or from customizations that were done on dolphin. check over at that MMS and you see your work being redistributed, with no recourse. the method here would involve submitting the module the module would be a licensed entity if it were purchased, and it would only be purchased one, one recycle one purchase, not a free-for-all store.
Let me state publicly before this idea gets much traction that I am totally against this concept and will not be a part of it. The bottom line is, no matter how you try to polish it off, once you give others the right to resell your products, developers are going to end up getting screwed over. I have had multiple clients who purchased a product then return to say "Sorry I should have purchased product B instead of product A as it fits the need of my site better" and six months later when I check their main site (or other sites they own), I see both modules in use. Depending on people's honesty is a difficult thing to do in the internet world. Not all clients who purchase products will expose their site details. There is really no way to track and verify if the module is destroyed after recycling.
sure there is, we would require the URL of the site where their dolphin site is running, however, you are correct, there is no way to stop a their if a thief is going to steal something, but for those who are honest and supportive of the developers and respectful of their work, how can it possibly hurt to recycle these mods. the mod in its recycled state, would be traceable, and as soon as an update comes out, that kinda weeds out verifiable mods with Transaction IDs
the model is not fully explained, however, the intent it to protect the developer, moreso than is being done now. this has been something that has been thought over, and considered all of the what-if's, but those same what-ifs exist if you are recycling or not.
so for those who are honest, and deserving, how can this be something,. that would be shunned without giving it a real once-over.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
lworld,
that is the sole purpose of the collaboration with the mod developer.
basically it is changing ownership, that is essentially it, and the mod developer is notified of that via the Recycle Program, so originalPurchaser has no more right to the module, and RecycledPurchaser is only reaping the benefits that came with the original purchase.
this is not messing with the developers income from the perspective they sold the module once, the module is recycled and they are compensated for participating in the recycle program. based on a % of the recycle fee suggested.
Much thought has gone into this recycling idea. After weighing pros and cons.
I agree with Modzzz . I see more problems with this than benefits. This is the mod creators income that will be affected. I think what we pay for our mods now is excellent considering if you asked an outsider programmer to create a mod the price would be multiple times more in cost.
The biggest problem with this is the mods are copyable so this creates endless problems an if you give them permission to resell can only end badly.
Another concern though is the problems this is capable of causing is not worth the time effort or % of the $ the mod creators will get.
I am not a mod creator but I know I am flat out with my site and do not have a minute to spare each day. Sure be great if I could get a few bucks for my mods I don't use.
But what happens then I recycle a mod, and a user purchases it,., then the next version of dolphin comes up and the person who bought my recycled mod upgrades then bitch and complain that the mod no longer works. I just don't have time to listen to people complain to me when I have enough things now to worry about. This is a drama waiting to be born.
Count me out. ....
Let me state publicly before this idea gets much traction that I am totally against this concept and will not be a part of it. The bottom line is, no matter how you try to polish it off, once you give others the right to resell your products, developers are going to end up getting screwed over. I have had multiple clients who purchased a product then return to say "Sorry I should have purchased product B instead of product A as it fits the need of my site better" and six months later when I check their main site (or other sites they own), I see both modules in use. Depending on people's honesty is a difficult thing to do in the internet world. Not all clients who purchase products will expose their site details. There is really no way to track and verify if the module is destroyed after recycling.
The biggest problem with this is the mods are copyable so this creates endless problems an if you give them permission to resell can only end badly.
there is a controlled entity, so the modules are not being redistributed freewill, one module comes in for recycle, one module goes out, and that is even if its purchased. that was the whole idea behind making sure there is a controlling factor, "license" which is missing on most of the modules released today, thus they get freely distributed. there is no permission to resell being requested, the essence of this is that the module is changing ownership, the mod developer has not lost anything and matter of fact, they way it was considered on a positive note, may even gain, where a person would be able to purchase more modules that are Recycled, the developer would in turn obtain custom work, or additional work
Another concern though is the problems this is capable of causing is not worth the time effort or % of the $ the mod creators will get.
and this is where if a developer really considers this valiid, then they are making an effort to get over, since if you sell 100 mods, you should support 100 mods, if you sell 100 mods, and 30 purchasers quit using dolphin as we know they are apt to fall off quickly, then the developer has the responsibilty of 70 mods, so if you Recycled, or allowed to Recycle those 30 modules which were paid for but are no longer being used, how is this creating a problem, or not worth the effort. so you would consider it fair to sell 100 and support 70, though reaping the benefit of the 100?
I am not a mod creator but I know I am flat out with my site and do not have a minute to spare each day. Sure be great if I could get a few bucks for my mods I don't use.
But what happens then I recycle a mod, and a user purchases it,., then the next version of dolphin comes up and the person who bought my recycled mod upgrades then bitch and complain that the mod no longer works. I just don't have time to listen to people complain to me when I have enough things now to worry about. This is a drama waiting to be born.
thus Recycled and Collaboration, the mod developer would know the module transferred ownership, because there is a process in place that declares the ownership has been transferred. so a Recycled Mod would be subjective to the same upgrade as if the module was still in use by the original owner, Recycling does not allow for multiple distributions, the process in place is to collaborate with the mod developer, the license with a uniqueness, that would utilize the database as well as spanned files from within the module which checks the files, and if at any given time, one component is missing, either from the database or from one of several files, then the module would cease to work, and the user would have to request support on the module. and as a TOS, if the license protection is tampered with, the agreement is considered NULL and VOID, and the module would be removed from the list in which is subjective to upgrades, due to the TOS violation, in tampering with the license module on the Recycled Module.
Count me out. ....
we have given great consideration to all of these things mentioned, and have watched for years, as these developers were being ripped off, and never has it been suggested a manner in which to help in control the redistribution of their modules. the full TOS and Scope of Recycle was not written here, but i can assure you, the mod developers best interest is at hand here.
and one thing that was mentioned from modzzz, if user purchases module1, the documentation is of such that there would be required signatures that they realize the module being purchased is recycled, and as such there is a license mechanism, and these things are all agreed upon, so there is no going back, and saying i meant to purchase module5, the documentation will be specific and the purchasers signatures, would be required that they acknowledge what they are purchasing. so there is no rope-a-dope, get two for one.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
I think developers really should change their mind that all customers are only thieves trying to rip them off. What Dos proposing here can be one of way how customer can actually legally sell something what he not need anymore or is not happy with anymore. If this idea will be declined ... peoplealways find a way how to sell something... |
i can see why there is the standoffishness initially, but if it were fully understood what the intent is, its more along the lines of ownership transfer, while keeping the mod developer in the loop, and taking the extra step to secure the mod from piracy distribution, by applying the license
I think developers really should change their mind that all customers are only thieves trying to rip them off. What Dos proposing here can be one of way how customer can actually legally sell something what he not need anymore or is not happy with anymore. If this idea will be declined ... peoplealways find a way how to sell something...
i think a thorough review of this service would reveal that the best interest of the developer is at hand, and not looking to launch a free-for-all sell my mods option.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
I think if we call it paid license transfer or resell module to other person is sompy same meaning :-) but well license transfer souds better ( mainly for developers:-) ) |
>'UnityMember purchases modX from Developer1, the mod is determined unusable'
This is a fine line. Firstly - why he did purchase product if he is not going to use it in future?
And secondly - what in case if buyer will buy big pack of products and then - asks for refund (like unusable) for anything? In this case he can buy all necessary products here, then build own website, and then asks for that refund from each seller here. In result - buyer is happy, seller is not happy.
I do not mind that the buyer sold the site in the future. It is ok.
Some 'customers' are building website for following sell.
But I not sure about granting rights to re-sell products separately. Who going to control this process?
I am sure that we should work as most of e-stores. As example http://www.templatemonster.com/
Anybody can join this website and sell own templates. But I not sure that they allow buyers to exchange products (anyway - we can ask administration of that website about this) .
Sorry for my english.
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My 2cents worth;
I understand the idea and sympathize with the purchaser, but although I am not a developer i can relate to their hesitancy.
If I were a developer I would not want my mods or products being resold to another person, despite the fact that I get a cut back. Now it seems I am the affiliate and not the original developer.
Investigate, chat with the developer, test, retest, talk to others who have purchased the product, and when it suits you and your site make the purchase. If you find you made a mistake; then unfortunately you are out of luck. The only way this can be worked out is if the developer is perhaps willing to exchange a product or refund a small portion of the original cost. It should be at the discretion of the developer.
Perhaps one way is for the developer to hook their mod to the domain it is purchased for, is this possible to do?
I am sorry, this is too complex a process to allow others to resell your mods. I think it does not make much sense. And this cannot be compared to a a car, or tv or phone, it is not the same thing.
Instead of trying to create an elaborate scheme to allow reselling and all this mumbo jumbo. I say allow and promote high quality developers who design solid reliable and reasonably priced modules to flourish and support. Get rid of the poor developers, cheaters, poor coders, rip off artists. Those are the ones that are causing the problems, not the ones that are honestly trying to make a living.
Create a solid foundation of developers who the users can rely and depend on. Protect the good ones and get rid of the bad eggs.
Ok I have said my peace.
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the feedback is going good here. i do not envision this as complex. though the TOS and Agreements would be substantial, but what this does not allow, and that is where this is being misinterpreted. this does not allow just anybody with a module to resell the module.
hence the collaboration, they can apply for Recycling, the mod developer is contacted, and verifies that memberA is the original owner.
memberA completes the application, agreeing that if the module gets Recycled, that they are relinquishing user and priveleges for that module, and furthermore agreeing to remove all instances from their hard drives both server and local.
My 2cents worth;
I understand the idea and sympathize with the purchaser, but although I am not a developer i can relate to their hesitancy.
If I were a developer I would not want my mods or products being resold to another person, despite the fact that I get a cut back. Now it seems I am the affiliate and not the client.
Investigate, chat with the developer, test, retest, talk to others who have purchased the product, when it suits yu make the purchase. If you find you made a mistake; then unfortunately you are out of luck. The only way this can be worked out is if the developer is perhaps willing to exchange a product or refund a small portion of the original cost.
Perhaps one way is for the developer to hook their mod to the domain it is purchased for, is this possible to do?
I am sorry, this is too complex a process to allow others to resell your mods. I think it does not make much sense. And this cannot be compared to a a car, or tv or phone, it is not the same thing.
Instead of trying to create an elaborate scheme to allow reselling and all this mumbo jumbo. I say allow and promote high quality developers who design solid reliable and reasonably priced modules to flourish and support. Get rid of the poor developers, cheaters, poor coders, rip off artists. Those are the ones that are causing the problems, not the ones that are honestly trying to make a living.
Create a solid foundation of developers who the users can rely and depend on. Protect the good ones and get rid of the bad eggs.
Ok I have said my peace.
then after all that is satisfied, the module is accepted based on stringent parameters and qualifications, and offered to Recycle.
module1 is a success in the Recycle member1 relinquishes ownership, member2(new owner) provided a transfer of ownership with. this specific module will no longer qualify for the Recycle Program.
mod developer is notified of who the new owner of the module is.
reading what is posted, that inquiry you have here about hooking the mod to the IP, is exactly what i have been saying.
not only the IP, but can be bound to the IP | Domain | Directory any one or a combination of, via the license creation.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
the feedback is going good here. i do not envision this as complex. though the TOS and Agreements would be substantial, but what this does not allow, and that is where this is being misinterpreted. this does not allow just anybody with a module to resell the module.
hence the collaboration, they can apply for Recycling, the mod developer is contacted, and verifies that memberA is the original owner.
memberA completes the application, agreeing that if the module gets Recycled, that they are relinquishing user and priveleges for that module, and furthermore agreeing to remove all instances from their hard drives both server and local.
My 2cents worth;
I understand the idea and sympathize with the purchaser, but although I am not a developer i can relate to their hesitancy.
If I were a developer I would not want my mods or products being resold to another person, despite the fact that I get a cut back. Now it seems I am the affiliate and not the client.
Investigate, chat with the developer, test, retest, talk to others who have purchased the product, when it suits yu make the purchase. If you find you made a mistake; then unfortunately you are out of luck. The only way this can be worked out is if the developer is perhaps willing to exchange a product or refund a small portion of the original cost.
Perhaps one way is for the developer to hook their mod to the domain it is purchased for, is this possible to do?
I am sorry, this is too complex a process to allow others to resell your mods. I think it does not make much sense. And this cannot be compared to a a car, or tv or phone, it is not the same thing.
Instead of trying to create an elaborate scheme to allow reselling and all this mumbo jumbo. I say allow and promote high quality developers who design solid reliable and reasonably priced modules to flourish and support. Get rid of the poor developers, cheaters, poor coders, rip off artists. Those are the ones that are causing the problems, not the ones that are honestly trying to make a living.
Create a solid foundation of developers who the users can rely and depend on. Protect the good ones and get rid of the bad eggs.
Ok I have said my peace.
then after all that is satisfied, the module is accepted based on stringent parameters and qualifications, and offered to Recycle.
module1 is a success in the Recycle member1 relinquishes ownership, member2(new owner) provided a transfer of ownership with. this specific module will no longer qualify for the Recycle Program.
mod developer is notified of who the new owner of the module is.
reading what is posted, that inquiry you have here about hooking the mod to the IP, is exactly what i have been saying.
not only the IP, but can be bound to the IP | Domain | Directory any one or a combination of, via the license creation.
But don't you think that all this elaborate measures for 1 single module is a waste of resources and energy? Which would serve us well by having a stronger and healthier development team?
I mean let's say $75 for a mod and the amount of time that is used to make the transfer to another purchaser, seems rather tedious.
One option can be for the purchaser to be given a time frame of say 30 days to install and use the software, if it does not work for him then no harm no foul. Just like a trial period for many other software's that are being sold on the net. I think developers here should allow download and trial period for the mods.
After the trial period I think you own the product. Done and over.
Let me ask one last question, does Boonex allow their software license to be resold to another Domain or user? So after 6 months can I sell my license to a new user for $60? Not trying to be funny, I am curious.
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I have been hit with charge backs a number of times and quite often see the module still in use which indicates to me that the charge back was not done because the module was faulty or they no longer could use it.
With that being said i hope you understand i have a trust issue with this.
I feel the only way to make this work is that the modules have a licencing system in them from day one. This way the original licence can be canceled preventing the module from working on the original domain. This because i cannot trust the original owner to remove/destroy all original copies.
I have been screwed enough times that i had been seriously considering doing this to all my modules.
However i have seen a number of times in the forums that many buyers will not purchase modules that have encrypted code.
So i will ask this question and correct me if i am wrong.
1) Adding a licencing system to the php code will require part of the code be encrypted to protect the licencing system
2) The server will require a decoder to run encrypted scripts.
I may be wrong. Perhaps there is a method to encrypt where no server-side changes need to be made to run it.
https://www.deanbassett.com |
you are 100% correct, the modules should have all been licensed to start with. that has not been the case, and in fact, was something i had contacted mod developers about when D7 was beta. there were some who were willing, but in order to have such a platform built, it would be costly, and needed more than 2 or 3 to be game for that venture.
I have been hit with charge backs a number of times and quite often see the module still in use which indicates to me that the charge back was not done because the module was faulty or they no longer could use it.
With that being said i hope you understand i have a trust issue with this.
I feel the only way to make this work is that the modules have a licencing system in them from day one. This way the original licence can be canceled preventing the module from working on the original domain. This because i cannot trust the original owner to remove/destroy all original copies.
I have been screwed enough times that i had been seriously considering doing this to all my modules.
However i have seen a number of times in the forums that many buyers will not purchase modules that have encrypted code.
So i will ask this question and correct me if i am wrong.
1) Adding a licencing system to the php code will require part of the code be encrypted to protect the licencing system
2) The server will require a decoder to run encrypted scripts.
I may be wrong. Perhaps there is a method to encrypt where no server-side changes need to be made to run it.
i think the best thing for me to do on this deano, i think i will take deanos tools, run it through the licensing, and you can have a go at it. yes, you could remove part 1 however, if you build the licensing so that its dependant on other elements of the license, where it is doing internal checks, if one element fails, the module shuts down.
you would have some encrypted elements, that are not going to deter the functionality of the module. i think the best approach for you, since you do at minimum have questions as to how it works, is to take it to task.
when i get it setup, you can then download. but will require competing the registration form, so you could get the download.
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
so in all actuality on this, its not so much that you think recycling is an issue, overall because your mods are released without any licensing you are abused.
Let me state publicly before this idea gets much traction that I am totally against this concept and will not be a part of it. The bottom line is, no matter how you try to polish it off, once you give others the right to resell your products, developers are going to end up getting screwed over. I have had multiple clients who purchased a product then return to say "Sorry I should have purchased product B instead of product A as it fits the need of my site better" and six months later when I check their main site (or other sites they own), I see both modules in use. Depending on people's honesty is a difficult thing to do in the internet world. Not all clients who purchase products will expose their site details. There is really no way to track and verify if the module is destroyed after recycling.
this is exactly why i am pushing the licenses, you want to send me a mod or two and we can run it through the licensing, so you can see how it works. i have also invited deano to do the same.
believe this developers, i am on your side, and never would suggest anything that would be harmful. yes, this is an unorthodoxed strategy, and i think if given a half a chance, it will be realized, that the intent was to provide a secure area unlike MMS, where honest good people could, if need be, Recycle a Mod or two, and in that course, have the developers blessing
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
Recycling is a good thing, it preserves ideas and innovate things. I'm in! :) Unlock Your Future |
As Deano pointed out..I have to say if recyclking will lead that all developers will start release mods encoded and domain locked for one domain only than Im againts recyclingt as then result will be that I can recycle module but will pay 500x more as all devs switch to encrypting & one domain licensing scheme ... so than it will be highly contraproductive... |
It could be on a IP address(per server basis also) Or even bulk licencing. In any case it provides the developers to shut off the keys of the previous owner.
https://www.deanbassett.com |
no, they are not going to switch, if they were going to switch, would have done so when the modules started getting created.
As Deano pointed out..I have to say if recyclking will lead that all developers will start release mods encoded and domain locked for one domain only than Im againts recyclingt as then result will be that I can recycle module but will pay 500x more as all devs switch to encrypting & one domain licensing scheme ... so than it will be highly contraproductive...
if the modules work, there there is nothing wrong with using encryption. i use visionworld for my support tickets, 100% encrypted, but i seldom have problems
When a GIG is not enough --> Terabyte Dolphin Technical Support - Server Management and Support |
DosDawg
third party would review the application, and collaborate with the mod developer, if mod developer is in agreement, that memberA is the original owner of the module, and agrees to allow resale of the said product: third party resource would allow the module to be uploaded,(collaborate)
license key would be applied, and product would be provided with on the market for download, with a qty 1, so once the module was resold, then it would remove itself from the market.
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This is a good idea I think it is doable. :)
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Dosdawg: YOur idea is good, but as I see from some reaction there is high probability that all developers will sell module locked to only one domain and than whole license transfer thing will lead mainly to high raise of money user will have to spent on market as amount of people who will want later on transfer license will be a minimum in comparsion much higher cost of modules as I will have to buy separate licences for use of mod for my every site... |
