Matt said "NO"

Andrew Boon posted 18th of July 2009 in . 126 comments.

It's the first time that I post a link to my personal blog at Unity. I want to share with my friends.

http://www.andrewboon.com/archives/1078

UPDATE:

Regarding relevancy of this post and compliance with Rules.

Some members noted that this post should be removed/moves since it doesn't accord with Unity Rules that we imposed just recently.

Q.

"Andrew, explain to me how you can impose these rules upon Unity members if you do not follow them yourself. By posting this blog, you are telling everyone that its OK to post blogs about whatever they damn well please. Or are you, yourself, exempt from the rules?:

A.

First of all, I believe that this post is exacly in accordance with BoonEx goal, meaning and mission. Maybe not the specific arguments, but the attempt.

Second, BoonEx employees and owners ARE exempt from these rules and I can see no reason why it should be different. We have our own internal rules, family rules, etc. The Unity Rules are set in an attempt to moderate the community, not to guide the company operations. Thus, we can, for example post promotional posts, delete others' posts by our sole discretion, or even scrap the Rules altogether. If that sounds harsh or unfair, you obviously don't understand the situation.

Third, whenever we consider shared content valuable, positive, helpful and otherwise contributing to goals and mission of this site - it may stay, even if it breaks the rules. Thus we can post Birthday congratulations, invitations to vote for us, public apologies or whatever we see fit.

 
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greymatters
"The only reason why they think it tastes good is because they are forced to get used to it, by marketing, ads, misinformation, friends, and first of all - parents."

True Andrew.

Cows are symbol of Love for 1000s of years. I can see that in those photos. You made my day.

Lots of Love.
CodeSatori
I'm curious Andrew, I see a lot of new and oriental thought in your output, are you a follower of a particular ideology, or more of an eclectic?
Andrew Boon
Absolutely eclectic. Trying to keep thinking.
CodeSatori
Great. Doctrinal stagnation is one of the biggest obstacles to human evolution, it has always been and I suspect it may well ever be.
LightWolf
Well welcome to the world of naughty spam unoboonex..lol Anita you are wasting your time here as he is in love with his "WIFE". Wow I can not believe how the young's morals fly out the window.Do you females not have any respect for yourselves? I read your post unoboonex and well all i can say is i am a country girl raised on a farm and we had cows to feed our family. Without the farm i am sure we would not all be here today. I to also had pet cows and had to learn to let go of my feelings see more as a child when it came time to load up the freezer for winter and say good bye. I do believe God put animals of sort on earth to feed his children and see nothing wrong with raising animals for food. But your childs pic was cute and loving..Blessings to you and your family.
DosDawg
to each his own in regard to this matter. for me, i couldnt imagine eating anything else. now granted, i am not a hunter, however, i know thats not the topic here, i specifically dont actually like the killing part, but once its in a package, im chowing down.

im glad a cow is a symbol of love, i agree, i love to eat those suckers.

if this offends anyone, i assure you its not meant to. i just as lightwolf, was raised on a farm, with rabbits, goats, cows, chickens, turkeys, ducks, geese, and see more there were there for a purpose, and it wasnt to just muck up the yard hello.

where i dont think i would eat cat, dog, parakeet, by choice, but, hunger my friend will do strange things to ones beliefs.

Regards,
DosDawg
houstonlively
Yeah.... Barbecued texturized soy protein just doesn't sound right... does it? Chicken fried tofu... no thanks.
iced
LOL these 2 have really cracked me up... Im laughing hard in my office now. PPL will be wondering what is wrong with me. I am a carnivore... Meat makes me strong and happy... My wife stuffs lots of vegetables in my dinner every day and boy I don't like that at ALL.

I cannot go without eating meat for more than 2 days MAX.

I do care though about how the meat I eat is raised, catered for and butchered! It has to be in a respectful way.

I also hate to see meat or food (especially on UK Childrens see more TV) being misused, thrown about and a subject of comedy when there are so many others who would willingly eat THAT meat that they are throwing around!

Again "Barbecued texturized soy protein" and "Chicken fried tofu".... LMFAO hahahahahaha!
greymatters
Hmmm what to say...??

I am working these days on my 1st Dolphin website www.oshoebooks.com/osholovers/ 300 ebooks to be uploaded to this site and i was reading an eBook of Osho and came across these lines, i want to paste those lines here...

"How do you know that something is food? -- if you are hungry and it satisfies you, you know. It is very difficult for a man who has no appetite to find out what food is.
Psychologists have come across a very significant fact: that if small children see more are left to themselves, they always choose the right thing to eat. You put everything around, you leave it on the dining table, don't force anything, and don't say what to eat and what not to eat. It has been a tremendous discovery that children eat only the right thing in the right time. If a child is suffering from something and a certain thing is needed which will be helpful for it, he will choose to eat it. By the time that suffering disappears he will stop eating that. We confuse them. We tell them to eat this and don't eat that. Then by and by, their natural instinct functions no more.
Have you seen animals eating? They are not dieticians, and they never go to any dietician, but a buffalo or a cow just chooses the right grass for itself, instinctively. They will leave other grasses; they will eat only the grass that is right for them. You cannot deceive. Somehow their inner nature, their appetite, decides."

OSHO eBook : The Beloved, Vol 1
Chapter : #4
Chapter title: The only criterion is your thirst
Question : #2
Technoman
Actually Andrey it is not your first time you have also mentioned your blog on here in 2008 ..



http://www.boonex.com/unity/blog/entry/Andrey_Sivtsov_Andrew_Boon
mastermindsro
I couldn't watch that movie till the end.. I was already sick to my stomach on the half of it..
This is happening because people today eat what they shouldn't.. It's a sick world.. and this is reality!
Last year's July I became vegetarian too, so this month on 15 I celebrated that as one of my best achievements in life..
Technoman
congrats to you
" mastermind "
on your 1 year anniversary!

Keep it up!
netguy21a
Glad u r a vegetarian. I am proud of myself being vegetarian, as my culture dont support it.
gineta
YHm very proud you . But I am proud of eat any meat is possible. Meat is a important question for strong life.
I work before in a vegetarian center more of 2 years and only eat vegetable make you agil but never strong.
The question is only meat from chicken or cow is really good for the human body . Other meat like pork I think is really dangerous for healthy life
kosmic
i couldnt agree more being vegetarian too for 10 years.

We have an abundance of foods we can eat apart from animals, so why make them suffer?

When you see the full process of farming animals on a mass scale, it aint pretty.

Im not talking outer mongolia where they have to hunt to survive and eat every bit of the animal as not to waste anything....im talking about your supermarkets/fast food joints.

Its a personal choice at the end of the day, but breaking that chain can only be helped see more by buying locally farmed animals if you have to.

oh and go along to the abatoire too....sure you'l feel hungry after that. (shudder)
Andrew Boon
@DowsDawg:

In fact I was raised on a farm either. I saw chicken beheading since I was 3, I participated in pigs slaughter twice a year and it was a family "event". We've been given pigs tails and years for play - I was 5 or 6 y/o. I de-feathered bleeding ducks and hens. At the age of 20 I couldn't live a single day without meat. I was RAISED to be a carnivore. But I'm sure I was not born as one.

I was lucky to escape. Thank you Julia for your passionate and hard work... for your see more constant fight for self-improvement.
Andrew Boon
@LightWolf

Thank you.

I am not preaching, really, just sharing my understanding and happy to know yours.

What I was trying to express is that we are grown with this notion that meat is important. It becomes more and more important, actually. But, it all because of us, our own choice, which many of us make without full understanding of what we do.

Imagine that you've been raised on a banana farm... Do you think the world could live without bananas? Most definitely. We adapt. We make our see more own choices.
Andrew Boon
@kosmic

I was thinking about Mongolia, and cases alike. I'd eat meat if I had to. Even now, even after this film. There are situations, maybe even places where you can justify doing that.

The problem is that people don't eat meat because of hunger. They eat meat because of hunger for meat.

Now Americans eat the same amount of chicken EVERY DAY as they did in one whole year in 1930. What kind of physiological changes happened since then? Nothing. It's all about KFC, McDonalds and likes see more - mass murder plants that streamlined the process and now can raise an earthling fast, kill it cheap, deliver it fresh.

At the same time Americans are among those blessed nations that really do have a choice. We've spent 5 months in US this year and its mindblowing variety of vegetarian food was just eye-opening.
LightWolf
Okay was going to let this go but since you are stereo typing I must put this in. Americans are NOT the only meat eaters and it feels a bit like you are attacking only our ways unoboonex. This is not right to just cast us only. The whole WORLD eats meat.
Andrew Boon
Americans, IMO, are more concerned and educated about this issue than most (no all) other nations. So, I was not stereotyping. It's just that we have more information about Americans, which is also a very good sign.

Right now I am in Kyrgyztan. It's Summer. Tons of fruit and veggies, dirt cheap. Still, 99 out of 100 locals eat meat every day. EVERY SINGLE DAY.

I am sorry of I sounded like bashing Americans. I have nothing but respect and love to this nation and my highest hopes for change see more are all on Americans.
Andrew Boon
@graymatters

Exactly! I was trying to express my views on a certain form, but it turned out to be that it's all about instinct. I just feel, but, sadly, I realize that my sensors are affected by other factors. So I look at my son and see him making choices of his own, but looking for my approval. He needs my wisdom, my advice, but I need his wisdom so much more. He still knows what is right. I just guess.

If I offer him choices - fruit, veg, meat, cooked food, he'd always choose fruit first, see more going on to fresh veggies if he's hungry. He'd drink a lot, mostly water.

But I know I can trick him and his feelings. I can give him a handy sausage, maybe with cheese, ketchup or mayonnaise. I can keep saying - "go for it, it's meat, it'll make you strong, your body needs it". Look, I am his GOD, his absolute authority, his truth. I am above his instincts. He'd believe and later on it'll come with no effort. He'd even defend meat diet vigorously.

You can eat meat, no problem with that. You make your own choices. But be true to yourself. Just don't close your eyes. At least try to learn from your children BEFORE they learn from you.
Technoman
Andrey -->
you wrote this

( Look, I am his GOD, his absolute authority, his truth. )
_____________

"You are not God", Andrey!



I have a pretty big ego myself. We all have egos (if you don't, you aren't human) but never say your GOD or GOD towards someone cause you are not!

But then being christian I believe that there is only 1 GOD!
Andrew Boon
You know it's a "figurative" speaking. I'll be more careful with terms, and perhaps I should've skipped "GOD" for being politically correct. But still you got the point, right? At the age of 3 parents practically build the child's understanding of life.
houstonlively
I must be a really strange case. As a child, and up to the time I finished high school, I rarely ate meat, and I guess you could say I was almost a vegetarian. After leaving home at the age of 17 to attend more school, was when I realized I was a carnivore. It's not really something I decided... it just happened. It's in my genetic code. I am a carnivore by nature and make no apologies.
eclectech99
Are we Carnivores? Are we Herbivores? Are we Omnivores?

That's one of those questions that will never be answered, I'm afraid. Scientists have tried, and you will hear good arguments on all sides.

I tried the vegetarian thing for three months. Ultimately, the craving for meat won the battle. It's interesting though, I've hated veggies my whole life. Once I made them my only diet, I not only started to enjoy them, I started eating new veggies as well.

After I fell off the veggie wagon, my see more taste for those veggies dwindled again. One could argue that the reason for aquiring a new found taste for veggies, was because we are meant to eat them. Others could argue that you acquire a taste for whatever you eat the most at a given time.

Yes, we do spice the hell out of meat, just to make it edible. But I'm not sure that makes a great argument as to why we should be eating veggies. I could use those same spices to try and make my salad taste better too. It won't work though. The fact is, that we spice the hell out of everything we eat. It gives us new dishes, and new found flavors. Our taste buds are always on the hunt for new goodies.

What we should really be deciding is not whether or not we eat veggies or meat, but what we put in our bodies in general. Is the meat we are eating injected with hormones? What do they feed the cattle that we are eating? Are the veggies we are eating sprayed with pesticides? Is the soybeans I'm eating genetically modified, in order to resist the pesticides?

hmmmmmmm.....
Andrew Boon
Science and opinions always shift. I was trying to base my point on something a little more stable - compassion.
hdavy2002
I used to be a meat lover but now my thoughts are changing. Take a look at this video.

http://www.goveg.com/factoryFarming.asp
houstonlively
Uno, I have to ask, why on earth did you start such an obviously controversial topic. There's obviously going to be some pretty strong opinions on both sides of the aisle here, and I'm not sure this is the right place to start a debate on this subject.

I know it probably wasn't your intention to get people riled up over this, but it's headed in that direction. I would not be surprised if tempers soon start flaring. I have some pretty strong opinions on this subject, but It's probably best that see more I keep them to myself. With that said, I'm outta here (this blog) before I say something I regret.
CALTRADE
Give me carne asada burritos, or give me death!
Andrew Boon
Well... I know it's controversial. I know it will fire back to me. I know it's been talked to death. I know you know about it.

Now, however I start looking at what I FEEL more and more, no at what I KNOW.

I love reading your comments. I am happy for I rave raised this subject again. I feel that I was right. Come what may.
carnytown
Probably the worst topic to blog on, here. But that said. You are soooooo wrong. First deal with taste. Things taste good to us because our bodies need the necessary combination of chemicals in the food we are tasting. And the vitamins. Secondly, we are carnivorus. The scientific and medical community will attest to this. Man is a beast of prey. Our original diet consisted almost entirely of meat from the flesh of dead animals.
You are trying to make humans into something to equal the gods. We are see more not. We have been given the desire and need for certain types of meat. Some races prefer Lamb, other races see more benefit from red meat and some races exist better on Fish. But, it is rare to find humans of any race that exist better on just greens. In fact many types of vegetables like tomatoes are really bad for some races and cause physical pain. Many nightshades are semi-poisonous to some, not all.
You are trying to group man into one simple definition, and you cannot. We are all different and most likely evolved from different combination's of creatures and therefore need certain diets.
Andrew Boon
Probably the worst topic to blog on, here, yet I am happy it appeared somewhere where we have so many different, mature and often influential people sharing their views.

"we are carnivores"

That's what I was TOUGHT by my parents, too. As far hard facts, general scientific consensus, or my personal observations I am not convinced. Not at all.

You sound sure and you bring up great points. Some can't eat tomatos, some prefer fish over meat, etc. I know people who eat only fresh fruit see more and veggies and particularly love raw potatoes. They eat potatoes only for weeks and LOVE the taste.

Form that I can infer that we are lucky to have a highly adaptive digestive system, which we can train to consume just about anything. I don't buy into "necessary vitamins, chemicals" argument for the very reason that I see MUCH more healthy-looking vegetarians than "carnivores". C'mon I've been there! I know the difference and I watch my own body changing and reacting to new food. After a few years of being vegetarian my weight is the same as it was when I was on a meat diet (50% meat at least), but I feel SO much better.

Yes, we are different, but I'm calling to what YOU say is right, not what I try to make you believe in. It's YOU who teach your kids to be gentle and caring, loving and compassionate. Just not to full extend... you don't say it all until they're ready for truth.
CodeSatori
I was a vegetarian absolutist for 12 long years, a fair half of it featuring an additional bunch of yogic restrictions, Ayurvedic guidelines and so on. I have since joined the omnivores again, and in fact was originally led back to a more open diet during my days as a Buddhist anagarika wandering in North India, as for them all almsfood was equal and not a subject to discrimination.

Vegetarianism is not something that can be conclusively proven to be natural or necessary by any scientific measure. see more Like all things, it has its pros and cons. If we argue for vegetarianism on the basis of diverse spiritual reasons, we merely open another Pandora's Box of loosely defined ideas as food for an endless and futile debate. There is no point debating if there isn't a shared conceptual framework.

In this particular case, why not rather talk about what Andrew originally wrote about, which as I see it had to do with his appreciation of the kid's compassionate emotion for the animal.

Regardless of eating habits, compassion should be encouraged and taught as a general principle to children. As far as the details of application go, it's better to teach a method than teach a definitive solution.
Andrew Boon
Re: post of CodeSatory (above)

That sums it up. I didn't want another Veg vs Carni debate. You're free to choose. I was sharing an observation of what I was doing wrong, and thought that somebody else might be interested. The observation is that I wasn't telling truth about meat to my son, thus depriving him of freedom of choice. Simultaneously I was teaching him not to squash insects, not to beat girls and not to lie. Didn't feel right, so I shared.

"As far as the details of application see more go, it's better to teach a method than teach a definitive solution." (c) CodeSatori
greymatters
Hi friends,

My father was in Army, till 25 i ate meat 4 times in a week, no option was there.

When i married, my wife never ate meat from birth and a condition was there not to bring meat at home.

Later i ate at hotels, but slowly with meditation and awareness i skipped, but don't hate people who are killing and eating, they are just doing this because of unawareness.

Andrew's blog and the film "Earthlings" are like mirrors, we can see our real face there. Throwing the stones, see more and breaking the mirror will not do anything, we must 'face' our real face to change ourselfs.



"Pythagoras was the first to introduce vegetarianism to the West. It is of profound depth for man to learn how to live in friendship with nature, in friendship with creatures. That becomes the foundation. And only on that foundation can you base your prayer, your meditativeness. You can watch it in yourself: when you eat meat, meditation will be found to be more and more difficult.
Buddha was born in a non-vegetarian family. He was a KSHATRIYA -- belonged to the warrior race -- but the experience of meditation slowly slowly transformed him into a vegetarian. It was his inner understanding: whenever he ate meat, meditation was more difficult; whenever he avoided meat, meditation was easier. It was just a simple observation.
You will be surprised to know that the greatest vegetarians in the world have been Jainas -- but all their twenty-four Masters were born into families of non-vegetarians. They were all warriors; they were brought up as fighters. All the twenty-four Masters of the Jainas were KSHATRIYAS.
What happened? Why did these people who were brought up, conditioned from their very beginning to eat meat, create one day the greatest movement in the world for vegetarianism? Just because of their experiments with meditation.
It is an unavoidable fact that if you want to meditate, if you want to become thoughtless, if you want to become light -- so light that the earth cannot pull you downwards, so light that you start levitating, so light that the sky becomes available to you -- then you have to move from non-vegetarian conditioning to the freedom of vegetarianism.
Vegetarianism has nothing to do with religion: it is something basically scientific. It has nothing to do with morality, but it has much to do with aesthetics. It is unbelievable that a man of sensitivity, awareness, understanding, love, can eat meat. And if he can eat meat then something is missing he is still unconscious somewhere of what he is doing, unconscious of the implications of his acts."

OSHO eBook : Philosophia Perennis, Vol 2
Chapter : #6
Title : Enlightenment is Your Birthright
Andrew Boon
FYI:

Are human beings anatomically more similar to natural carnivores or to natural herbivores? Let’s find out….

"Intestinal tract length. Carnivorous animals have intestinal tracts that are 3-6x their body length, while herbivores have intestinal tracts 10-12x their body length. Human beings have the same intestinal tract ratio as herbivores.

Stomach acidity. Carnivores’ stomachs are 20x more acidic than the stomachs of herbivores. Human stomach acidity matches that of herbivores.

Saliva. see more The saliva of carnivores is acidic. The saliva of herbivores is alkaline, which helps pre-digest plant foods. Human saliva is alkaline.

Shape of intestines. Carnivore bowels are smooth, shaped like a pipe, so meat passes through quickly — they don’t have bumps or pockets. Herbivore bowels are bumpy and pouch-like with lots of pockets, like a windy mountain road, so plant foods pass through slowly for optimal nutrient absorption. Human bowels have the same characteristics as those of herbivores.

Fiber. Carnivores don’t require fiber to help move food through their short and smooth digestive tracts. Herbivores require dietary fiber to move food through their long and bumpy digestive tracts, to prevent the bowels from becoming clogged with rotting food. Humans have the same requirement as herbivores.

Cholesterol. Cholesterol is not a problem for a carnivore’s digestive system. A carnivore such as a cat can handle a high-cholesterol diet without negative health consequences. A human cannot. Humans have zero dietary need for cholesterol because our bodies manufacture all we need. Cholesterol is only found in animal foods, never in plant foods. A plant-based diet is by definition cholesterol-free.

Claws and teeth. Carnivores have claws, sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, and no flat molars for chewing. Herbivores have no claws or sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, but they have flat molars for chewing. Humans have the same characteristics as herbivores."
HernanL
I dream about slaughtering a cow and then eating the whole thing! Of course I don´t mean to torture the animal but to participate in the process of taking every single chunk of meat and, of course, eat them later. It would be as close to a communion with nature as any omnivore could dream of. Compassion, to me, does not apply to feeding. Animals kill their prays without compassion and, in most cases, their prays suffer more than when we killed them. We are animals and we feed from others as well. see more No place for morals. When you hit your dog with a newspaper because it did something wrong it doesn´t feel rancor to you, simply because it is an animal. I mean, we tend to imagine that animals feel and think the same way humans do. You cannot feel guilt for this. We cannot compare. But, since we do, what makes you think a piece of lettuce doesn´t feel asphyxiated when you tear if from the ground? I would say that it´s only beaause there is no expression as in an animal.
I believe the best we can do is to keep a natural balance. Do not abuse from any food source. Not all veggies, not all meat.
Yesterday somebody asked an open question to a group of friends in the beach: "What do we live for?" Some said the typical answer "to leave a legacy", and several other shades of this came up. The only thing I could think of was "to eat nice and tasteful things!" Yes, you could relate to the "last meal" before execution... So what!!
May you all have a good day and a better meal!!!
Regards,
Hernán
Andrew Boon
That's fine then. I have little to tell you and didn't really address to your situation in the post. There's place for everyone. I was talking about people who pretend to have compassion, even if applied to feeding, but fail to live up to their principles.

Be happy.
HernanL
Hi Andrew,
A quieck question, to see if I understood your poing. Would it be right, according to your point of view, to eat animals as long as they don´t suffer when they´re raised/slaughtered?
I live in Spain, where there is a national tendency to make bulls suffer in all possible ways (not only in bull rings). They say "it´s a tradition" and off they go with the "celebrations". Of course, this is quite cruel. But from this point to saying that we should not eat animals see more at all, I think there is a long way and nobody is 100% right, in general.

Regarding the comparison of the human body and that of herbivores, I think I heard our teeth are more carnivore-like than herbivore. Please correct me if I´m wrong. It´s a very interesting subject without a doubt!
Regards,
Hernán
Andrew Boon
I think it's only right to eat animals if you have absolutely no other choice. I would do that.

Regarding teeth... There's a bunch of myths about people being natural carnivores. All of them have been dismissed a good while ago, but people keep believing in age-old adages.

Re-quote:

"Intestinal tract length. Carnivorous animals have intestinal tracts that are 3-6x their body length, while herbivores have intestinal tracts 10-12x their body length. Human beings have the same intestinal see more tract ratio as herbivores.

Stomach acidity. Carnivores’ stomachs are 20x more acidic than the stomachs of herbivores. Human stomach acidity matches that of herbivores.

Saliva. The saliva of carnivores is acidic. The saliva of herbivores is alkaline, which helps pre-digest plant foods. Human saliva is alkaline.

Shape of intestines. Carnivore bowels are smooth, shaped like a pipe, so meat passes through quickly — they don’t have bumps or pockets. Herbivore bowels are bumpy and pouch-like with lots of pockets, like a windy mountain road, so plant foods pass through slowly for optimal nutrient absorption. Human bowels have the same characteristics as those of herbivores.

Fiber. Carnivores don’t require fiber to help move food through their short and smooth digestive tracts. Herbivores require dietary fiber to move food through their long and bumpy digestive tracts, to prevent the bowels from becoming clogged with rotting food. Humans have the same requirement as herbivores.

Cholesterol. Cholesterol is not a problem for a carnivore’s digestive system. A carnivore such as a cat can handle a high-cholesterol diet without negative health consequences. A human cannot. Humans have zero dietary need for cholesterol because our bodies manufacture all we need. Cholesterol is only found in animal foods, never in plant foods. A plant-based diet is by definition cholesterol-free.

Claws and teeth. Carnivores have claws, sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, and no flat molars for chewing. Herbivores have no claws or sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, but they have flat molars for chewing. Humans have the same characteristics as herbivores."
Andrew Boon
We also have a conversation going on in comments of my blog. There's a concern that the link to the film can potentially hurt children if they come across it.

Here's my opinion:

http://www.andrewboon.com/archives/1078#comment-526
greymatters
I am reading your blog, my daughter too, i suggest her to see the matt's photos and also see the documentary.
GargiDutta
Well this is controversial...i am not a dedicated meat eater.....in fact i prefer veg. But i find that i am very much compassionate towards animals. But there is something i wonder....its about milk and how we get it. The new born calves are first suckled and in the half way....sorry...not even half seconds actually...they are pulled apart from their mothers and while they shout their guts out ...the rest of the milk is collected for "our precious ones". Finally, the calf is left back for see more a drink or two.
I fail to understand whether milk is veg or non
veg. What category does this fall into? Should we switch to soy milk? I think "cruelty" should be minded and not our "eating habits" while treating animals.
Anyways, the pictures are really cute and may God bless your family.
Andrew Boon
Again, it's up to you. If you and your kids can choose taking milk with full understanding of where it comes from - so be it. Just don't close your eyes and don't lie.

I, for one, still eat milk-based products. I know it's wrong (for me) and want to quit. Hope I'll do it asap.
Jerismith
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ki1WlN3y2BI&feature=related
houstonlively
That was really fun to watch. Got any more of those?
Jerismith
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tBY6_GdJLI&feature=related

first post did not work but copy and past the second two and then do some more research on what you are eating and then decide.
elcentcom
before the flood nobody ate meat, only vegies and fruit.
In the book of Daniel it is reported that he refused to eat meat and this was his only sin he commited when he lied about that.

For myself. I wasn't eating meat from my birth until I grew up and went out of my parents home. Still I prefer good vegetarian meals now. Most people don't know about the varieties possible. It's fantastic and you feel a lot more healthier and energetic than otherwise.
Technoman
God creates. God destroys.

God said to Noah ...

Genesis 9:3 Every moving thing that lives shall be meat for you ...
Andrew Boon
Human being is a living thing either. You don't eat them though, because of morale. For some reason morale steps back when it's a cow.

I don't know if it's right or wrong, I just noted that I see a major break in connection, which we put to cover up ugly things from our kids and ourselves.
houstonlively
OK Andrew Boon, answer this one.

From your own Unity Blog Rules:

"Unity Blog is the place to discuss problems, ideas, suggestions related to BoonEx products and the BoonEx company. Do not post technical questions in the blogs. Please post it as the Answers section or the forums."

Andrew, explain to me how you can impose these rules upon Unity members if you do not follow them yourself. By posting this blog, you are telling everyone that its OK to post blogs about whatever they see more damn well please. Or are you, yourself, exempt from the rules? It's your site... you really can do whatever you choose. Your 'Green' blog went over like a lead balloon, and if you allow this one to continue, things are going to get pretty ugly around here. I really don't understand how you can allow this to continue. I respectfully request that you apply some common sense, before things get out of hand.
mastermindsro
come on houston.. it's summer :) we need to relax a bit.. you played the game and now you put this kind of questions? a little freedom in discussions is always better :)
gkcgautam
i had no time and intention to comment on this post, because i'm myself a vegan by my own choice.

But houstonlively, your comment forced me to say this.

How can you tell Andrew follow rules just for the sake of setting as example, or whatever you think? Today the world if facing a lot of environmental danger, just because of people who think the way you commented. They just think about their work, and never bother about what's happening around.

Even if one person decides to turn vegan because see more of this post, he can save around 520 animals in 10 years, if he ate meat twice a weak earlier. This number is nottoo less, and it can really make some impact if you think logically about it.

Please dont try to stop Andrew for the sake of following forum rules. Andrew and his team framed the rules to run UNITY with UNITY, and today he is being told to stop writing about compassion for animals.(or i wud say UNITY among humans and animals)

houstonlively, Soory but this wasnt good of you.
CALTRADE
Andrew has EVERY right to post whatever he wants on his personal blog - it is his blog. Those rules, I believe are from a "draft" constitution and should be corrected - you are correct that they do open him up to charges of hypocracy, and are being used by the so called "moderators" here as an excuse for censorship. I'll tell you, it really changes your opinion of a forum when they get involved in killing posts - especially blog posts. I have twice wasted my time writing see more up detailed comments on posts that were later deleted, and had one of my posts censored - and it was FAR less controversial than this. It will be MUCH better to just let people post what they want (but maybe make the "most recent" post a little less visible) rather than get involved in this social engineering.
CodeSatori
Space calling Houston... Usually company staff, and the CEO in particular, have a bit more leverage in what they can write and what not, since they as individuals are by default a part of what Boonex and Dolphin are.

Next time you see an angry bug and a coder talking in his blog about his butcher & barbecue evening, you can connect the dots and get to know the REAL STORY behind Dolphin. =D
houstonlively
I own websites. They have rules. The members follow the rules. I do too.
Andrew Boon
So, everyone is allowed to shut down your site? Modify it? Add banners? Change rules? Appoint admins/moderators?

Or have you stated a clause for every situation in the rules? Like "only I can update the site and have access to cPanel".
houstonlively
# mastermindsro

There is not going to be anything relaxing about this blog. Exactly what game is it that I played? Kindly explain that remark. If this was a personal blog area, I wouldn't give two shits what anybody posted. The simple fact is, this is NOT a personal blog area. This is a single blog with many different editors.... that's why there are posting rules.

If anyone other than a Boonex staff member posted a blog like this, per current rules, it would surely be deleted. We have see more all heard the vegetarian/ meat lovers debate hundreds of times and I'm sick of hearing it, because it's always the same. Inevitably, there's always the fanatics that posts cattle bashing videos and animal abuse videos.. I could go on and on.

I'm really tired of the self righteous attitudes people inevitably exhibit when this issue is discussed.

This entire blog needs to go away.
CALTRADE
You do make a point here - this is the official boonex blog, and he just posted a link to his personal blog. He should be able to post whatever he wants on his personal blog, but this is the official Boonex business blog. As I mentioned, something FAR less controversial was censored on my blog, which makes it feel tainted - compromised - no longer my blog.
houstonlively
Exactly.... and how long to you think this blog would have lasted if it were you that posted it, instead of Andrew? Not very long, I'd bet. I hate double standards, and I know you do too.
Andrew Boon
"If anyone other than a Boonex staff member posted a blog like this, per current rules, it would surely be deleted. "

Right, except if we'd find that the post corresponds with the goal and meaning of our company and the way it's presented is adequate.

You assume it's equality and democracy at its purest. Could be right, if we were building the site together sharing costs, profits, challenges and failures.

We do have different roles here, however, and with all due respect, when see more it comes to what we can do on this site WE ARE NOT EQUAL. We build BoonEx according to our views - it's about Uniting People, it's about going "Green", and it's also about compassion to animals. You can take what you want from it, and as long as you're not dragging us down you're very welcome to share your opinions too.
houstonlively
Excuse the double post, but if this section were designed right, it wouldn't happen.
gkcgautam
houstonlively, if you can somehow ignore this post, it might save hundreds of animals.

Think about it.
Technoman
I have supper every night like the rest of the world and I always have a equally balanced meal usually meat and vegies mixxed, "what is the big deal here" ?
Jerismith
I think it's a great discussion because it is not just killing animals for the sake of eating meat now, it is torturing. I would not be opposed to people eating meat that is sanitary to eat, not filled with chemicals and hormones and killed humanely. Animals these days are tortured and meat causes cancer and milk actually feeds cancer. Do the research and see. Look up or watch "The Gerson Theory" where someone discovered if you don't eat animal products and eat the right vegetables see more and fruits and so on YOU DON'T GET CANCER AND HEART DISEASE. For Houston I believe many people are raised on meat including me and when you realize how much you can actually eat that is meat and still get very full. You also feel much better. But if I was at a point where i was 10 years ago I would think it would be crazy to go vegetarian .....like some thing was wrong with it....but now thanks to Youtube.com I can see just how cruel the animals are treated and just how BAD the meat is for you.....please do some research on "The Gerson Theory" in you tube. People who are trying the gerson theory as a nutritional alternative to cancer treatment and heart disease and many other diseases are being cured. It includes no meat or dairy. They are reaaaaallllly bad for you........But if your freaked out about what am I going to eat now......just quit thinking a meal is centered around a piece of meat......it is not and you can get full with out it......just make sure you are getting your protiens through beans, nuts and veggies and your hunger for meat will completely go away.

I am not suprised to see so many non meat eaters on here because people who like to help communities and do these kinds of sites are usually very humanitarian oriented.......

Don't get angry houston because you are not sure how to survive not eating meet.......most people are not sure and do not know any other way. But just try not eating meat for one day and see what happens. If you eat nuts or beans along with other foods you wont crave the meat and you will feel better.....just try it for a day......
Technoman
Don't forget people that "Plants" are also living beings. Why do vegetarians rip them out of the soil & eat them?

It is said in the Bible that we should eat the meats that God has giving to us on earth....
houstonlively
You know that something is out of place when I find myself giving one of your posts a thumbs up.
DosDawg
i would have to second that.houston, i think what we have here is a clash of cultures in most cases. the next thing you know we are going to be reading about missionary positions vs. some other sutra position and why its better for the environment for you to blow your nose only in the southwesterly position.

but in all honesty, this is my opinion, and i respect and admire Andrew for what he does with the Dolphin application, this post was not actually meant to take place here, i dont think. if see more you would go view the cow, (all i seen was a steak and a brisket) but go view the cow on those pictures, and that is a blog where you are supposed to leave your comments. i left my comment but it was rejected, because man im like that ol' lady from the Wendy's commercials.

WHERES THE BEEF!

i hate the smell of anything green, i have in my life eaten very few vegetables, corn, potatoes, some fried okra from time to time. Now from a health viewpoint, i have never been sick, not even a cold, never anything wrong with my health at all, have all my hair, never broken a bone, have all my teeth, and i have never eaten the first bite of cabbage or collards.

i think its a matter of choice and also a matter of culture as to what you wish to eat, nobody says that you have to eat meat, well at least not in the US (yet).

as for the animals suffering, i cannot dissent or concur as to whether the animals suffer or not. i think i have posted that i do not choose to go out and kill now, but i do know one thing, if the necessity were to arise, between me eating plants of dying, i suppose i would choke down some spinach, and that is exactly what would have to happen, it would literally choke me to swallow spinach. the mere smell of greens, collards, cabbage, turnip greens (poke salad), make me sick to my stomach, but man the sweet smell of a smoking brisket, brings orgasm to my salivating glands.

houston, i dont think i would really get worked up about this post, it was not meant to cause harm, but i agree with you in regards to following rules and leading by example.

oh well happy eating to all, whatever you eat, as long as you are not eating me.

Regards,
DosDawg
Andrew Boon
@DosDowg

In my culture people didn't eat much veggies either. I was part of it.

It took years of time and most importantly lots of effort and will from my dearest wife to get me to the points where I am now.

Again, you have every right to think and act the way you choose. And if for any reason you decide to use your community site to deliver your idea - you have every right to do so.

Now, pretty please, don't hide my posts anymore.
Jerismith
Because when you hang a plant uplside down it does not kick and scream out in pain. And when you eat it you feel better not worse. It cures you and also does not bleeds and die when you cut it ......it actually grows again.......
DosDawg
matter of opinion. i have never eaten anything more than corn on the cob, potatoes, and an occasional batch of fried okra, i have eaten meat all of my life, and enjoy eating meat. i am no worse for the wear than somebody who has lived on green beans all their life.

Regards,
DosDawg
CALTRADE
You get my carne asada burrito when you pry it from my cold dead hands! Just kidding - I think a veggie meal one or two days a week won't kill us carnivores.
Technoman
Isn't it wrong to eat vegetables and fruits that contain seeds inside it, therefor all the plants your eating has seeds in it ( your killing the form of life being )!


Non Vegetarian people who claim to fight for animal rights and non vegetarian environmentalists are the biggest hypocrites in the world !!!

I eat meat, and yes I do agree with you "Jerismith".
I am 100% an animal lover, always had Cats etc, and I recognise the same traits in animals as humans!

Were not talking see more about dogs and cats, were talking about survival!

I will not deny the pain and suffering animals under go each and everyday, when slaughtered for food.
We have no right NOR authority to do so,no matter who or which religious book says so!

No it's not wrong to eat animals, But it is wrong to kill or keep them in an inhumane manner!
greymatters
Ha Ha,

Dear Technoman, think technically...

for your eating they are killing...

when less n less demand, less animals will be killed.
Andrew Boon
I agree wholeheartedly.

You can eat them (if you have to), but you shouldn't kill them. It's technically impossible, so we should be looking for alternatives. We are fortunate to have those.
houstonlively
Well.... the only good news about this blog, is that I seem to have located some of the missing 'Pundits'.

I am amused by the fact that they have time to post in this ridiculous blog, but they can't seem to find the time to enter a few D7 tickets in trac.
LightWolf
I noticed that also...hahaha too funny.
DosDawg
good observation houston. get em cap'n

eat meat, it does the body good, just not the body where the meat came from.


Regards,
DosDawg
gkcgautam
i know who's the target here!!

well, honestly saying i'm really busy.
finished with my engireening entrance exams a month back...and i DID NOT score well in them. For the last one i'm running here and there to get admission to some college.

My less marks in exam mean that i don't have the caliber to study computer science. The amazing fact is that they found it by testing my chemistry, physics and maths!!

And then i live in a state where we have powercuts of duration 12+ hours every single see more day. Do you think anyone can do some dolphin testing after that???

I HAVE NOT EVEN INSTALLED ANY DOLPHIN ON MY TEST SITE FOR TESTING.

I'm a pundit here, because Boonex knows that i did report things when i had time to do so.
But now what is more important for me is to get into some college and not testing Dolphin. Its the college which would give me the degree to survive.

If you say, i'm ready to return my Pundit Status.
Technoman
Its funny though,
Vegetarians that dont eat meat cause it's cruelity to kill animals for food.

Are you NOT feeding your animals meat all the time??

Animals like cats and dogs cannot be healthy without meat!

A snake eats mice
A fox eats rabbit

"whiskers" for animals is Meat and how many feed there animals this, well its the same thing there eating a killed animal to survive!
Andrew Boon
That's the whole point. Cats do what they feel is natural to them. We only eat meet after massive brainwashing by parents, thorough cooking and inventive re-labeling. I told about kids because they can still see a clear picture, like cats.
LightWolf
This post is really sad, sad to see how some people think. This one statement unoboonex well all i can say is wow!!

"I was talking about people who pretend to have compassion, even if applied to feeding, but fail to live up to their principles"

Now I have compassion for humans and animals, yet I eat meat, so you say this makes a liar out of me? I have given the last dollar i had for homeless people I try to help each day, and have and love animals and treat them as they were family, see more as they are family i should say. So just because i eat meat, i pretend to have passion? wow i think this blog should be deleted as it does not seem to be the right place for it, and well it does feel like us meat eaters are being attacked. Time to do some heavy thinking about this site. I would NEVER expected to see those words on your blogs,i thought you were more mature then that to bluntly state all this. Well it is your site, so whatever........
Andrew Boon
"I have compassion for ... animals, yet I eat meat, so you say this makes a liar out of me"

Yes. This is my observation and my option now. Important note is that I also think that you don't quite realize that you lie.

You should be giving heavy thinking about using any community site if someone's thoughts put off so badly.

I don't see how I "attacked" meat-eaters. No bans for meat-eaters' accounts, no removal of pro-meat comments, no licenses cancellation to those who see more eat meat.

In my blog I made it clear that all my assumptions are based on feelings, opinion and logic. I don't preach it. You can take it for what it's worth for you or skip altogether. You, however, chose to participate in the discussion and now you get more answers.

Whatever you say, I don't and I won't call YOU a liar. It's not my decision to make. I can however, freely express my view on whom I consider a lier or not. I called myself a lier that last weekend and shared this finding with you.
LightWolf
Well that pretty much made up my mind about staying here. To call me a liar is a insult and i must say is NOT good business. Thank you for helping me make up my mind on this unoboonex. I will leave now and not return, you are not a very nice man and hope in turn your karma bites you in the ass for what you have accused us meat eaters of. You attack my personal beliefs by calling me a liar, i would NEVER do that to you. You really have no clue what the Spiritual side of life is all about. But go ahead see more and keep on calling potential customers names and see how far you will get. Just because we DO NOT believe in your ways ,does NOT make us bad people and liars. I do not believe in what you preach but would never call you a liar.
Andrew Boon
@LightWolf

Is it a language barrier or you're just not listening? I didn't call you a liar. I specifically stated that I am not calling anyone here a liar, except for myself.

I found a disconnection of my beliefs and my deeds, reasoned that it's a lie and suggestion everyone to ponder on the subject.

You, not me, made a conclusion.

I wish you the very best.
eclectech99
It's funny...I posted a comment way earlier, but I think I shouldn't have. After reading Houston's posts, I think he has made a good point. This is not the forum for such a controversial subject. We design websites here, and we should keep it at that. There are a ton of websites for this sort of discussion. Why not a separate part of the site for this sort of thing?

It just seems to me that if it starts now, it will grow, and the next thing you know we wont be talking about dolphin anymore.
Andrew Boon
Dolphin is a result of the same considerations as those expressed in the post. The more you see us talking about making the world a better place the better Dolphin will become. This is the core motivation behind the whole project.
Stuart038
Houstonlively is quite right, this is a technical forum, not some ones personal crusade forum. Also, we have enough people outside of this forum trying to push there personal philosophies on us. Please Andrew, can we maintain a professional, technical forum, please.

As regards "Matt says No" how can you ask a child if he could eat his new found friend? apart from not understanding the true question of course he is going to say no.
Andrew Boon
I am sure we can maintain both professional/technical and social discussion here. The goal of the post does correspond with the mission of our company and will always be pursued by its founders, in every possible way.

I have no reason to think that Matt didn't understand the question. I asked him exactly as things are.
Andrew Boon
I am trying to show the flawed logic we all have now - real carnivores don’t lie to their kids. Tigers don’t have pets. Bears don’t have deer-friends. Wolves don’t need rabbits formed into an innocent-looking sausage to make a bite. We are not carnivores. We are humans.
CodeSatori
A division into herbivore and carnivore is somewhat artificial. There is of course the category of omnivores, species that eat both meat and plants, also featuring a number of primates --- that hunt in packs, just like early humans used to.

Meat eating isn't something that humans have recently invented, meat has been an important source of human nutrition since early prehistoric times. The amount of vegetables in our diet has only increased with the dawn of agriculture within the last 10,000 years.

Humans see more have known the use of fire and have used it to cook their food since days predating the rise of Homo Sapiens. Incidentally we also cook and season the bulk of the vegetables we eat. Raw potato, anyone?

As far as cultivating compassion etc. goes, every emotion is integrally tied with our perception of the world; and as much as perceptions vary, the applications of subjective emotions do. A believer in plant sentience would rather see an animal harmed if it were necessary for nutrition.

There is also a whole other body of considerations when it comes to direct and indirect violence. If you don't eat locally grown organic vegetables and fruits, the amount of violence associated in the planting, harvesting and delivery process is unbelievable.

For example, you could rephrase the question: "For every breadroll you eat, insects and mice will be killed by poisons and in the jaws of huge machines. Do you really want to eat that bread?"

If someone wants to be an ahimsa (non-violence) absolutist, I suggest you study Jainism and their solutions. They have pretty much taken it as far as it goes.
Andrew Boon
Perhaps it's just a weird direction of our moral dogmas. Maybe we should've maintain animals reputation as a food, and just that. I wouldn't worry then, I guess.

I am trying to ask my feelings about what's right and what's not. "Bread and dead mice" doesn't feel right. I'd try to change it somehow. Causing pain to a live being doesn't FEEL right to me either. Scientific reasoning or even logic is way less important. Even if we were created to eat meat doesn't mean we should keep on see more doing it. We don't have wings, but we started flying. We have limited sight, but we now see remote galaxies. We now try to avoid wars, cure deceases, plans flowers, build temples even protect animals. Our feelings evolve and when we listen to them we become better humans.

So, I felt that since we already need guts to see slaughtering it's probably the time to re-consider.
CodeSatori
All this seemed very clear-cut to me years back --- in fact I recall giving a decent number of sermons along the lines of some of the highlights of your blog. And I appreciate the heart of it, I do.

It was when I started digging deeper into the harm that any and all kinds of food production cause, and that coupled with an understanding of plant sentience and our sort of sentience not being the navel of the universe, it scattered my marbles pretty good.

We only feel easy about killing plants see more because we have so little in common with them. The question is, do we have the right to make humanity the standard for judging the rest of existence? On a more fundamental level, existence is so much more vast than our human worlds and the diverse standards of moral and ethics we have grown accustomed to over the millennia.

While I appreciate all the values behind the animal rights and vegetarian / vegan movements, I personally like to see all ideologies reach their conclusion, not stay hanging mid-way --- and the levels of absolutism required for some of these ideals to stay true are practicable for a naked Jain holy man who eats only fruit and filters his water to avoid killing small organisms.

When the natural conclusion of an ideology leads to something impracticable, it's hard for me to stay at a mid-way conclusion and remain true to myself. That doesn't feel right either.
DosDawg
Andrew,
i disagree with your concept that this post is in alignment with your mission for boonex Dolphin. First of all, i see you made an attempt to have run this from your personal "wordpress" blog. Now you are right, "you" and "your staff" are as you state allowable to post whatever makes your (shoes lace), however, engaging those members who are bound by the rules to become enraged and purport that one person is worse than another because of any personal preference see more is absolutely out of line. you could very well have ensured that any posts went to your "wordpress blog" and this community would not have to be affected by anybody elses personal beliefs.

If you wanted this to be known, if you wanted this to be shared on a non-controversial level, you could have taken other measures to get this information out to the community and if interested they could have posted on your "wordpress blog".

Now to even have to absorb the fact that you publicly state that you and your staff are exempt from "rules", that would tend to lead me to believe that this is an anarchist rule. I personally believe in lead by example and precedence. I have never agreed with do as i say do, not as i do mentality.

Now if you wanted to find out how others feel about eating greens or eating meat there are tons of other locations on the web where there are minds seeking that information. Those of us who participate in this community are here for the betterment of the application, and our personal lives, desires, cravings, religious preferences, or anything else not related to making this the best social networking application available open source on the internet today, just has no place on this site when its not related to site specifics.

I have had one complaint about the post i made regarding SC adopting the dolphin as the state mammal, where i felt that was a relavent cause and associated with the adopted dolphin Lighting, but certainly was not a confrontation topic, and did not raise the dander of any of the members.

The topic in general is controversial, and anything that would cause one member to think negatively of another member because of any choice or preference they have regarding their personal lives just has no place on this site.

Regarding the fact that you declare that you and your staff are exempt from rules, i just dont get that concept at all. I will think about this some more, but I cannot fathom how this is conducive to your MISSION as you state, is it your intent as a converted veg, that all who live on this planet do as you do, and have the choices in life that you have? if that were the case, then we could all live on the premise please make that clear. otherwise, i think you could have redirected any posts on this topic back to your "wordpress blog".

Regards,
DosDawg
Andrew Boon
Dos, there's only that much impact that your reasons to come here have on how this place should be shaped. You're here for software, so you can find it here. But there's more to the place, and some people, including myself want it to be so, and if it's not so, want it to become so.
CodeSatori
DosDawg: "Now to even have to absorb the fact that you publicly state that you and your staff are exempt from "rules", that would tend to lead me to believe that this is an anarchist rule."

Not all options to democracy or communism are anarchism. For example, the emperors and kings of yore were exempt from the rules. In the corporate world with a business like this, the imperator or CEO can easily use the company to further his idealistic goals, and I believe he is within his see more rights to do so.

Attempts to enforce democracy or other forms of "rule by the proletariat" (no offense intended!) rarely work with privately owned businesses. Now I don't know how that jibes with the Boonex Unity agenda. Controlled and transitional despotism or totalitarianism is often the method of choice to roll in a new environment, with all the evils and indignation it brings in the shorter term. Let's just deal with it and see what's coming.

I'm sure Andrew can shed more light on the Unity Mission (http://www.boonex.com/mission/) and its goals, and how it ties up with Dolphin, Boonex operations and so on. If he wants to include cows in the community, I have no problem as long as they don't moo too loud when I'm coding.
DosDawg
i hear codesatori. your answers each and everyone have been respectable and appreciated. you are right, not all options are, and if this was being dealt with on a platform of an environment was this belief was part of the Unitarianisms of that culture, this would not be a controversial discussion topic.

because we are all from diverse backgrounds and from all corners of this globe, we all have different beliefs on what would make the world a better place to live. the bottom line here is that this see more society as a whole, will never function as one, and there will always be contriteness from the different realms of the spectrum.

imma bug out of this one, but my position stands, i dont see where this is conducive to why the page builder is not working in D7, or for that matter, before we hammer out the ascii characters that D7 is beta, pagebuilder has not worked since D-6.0, can we get that fixed then sweat the cows and the chickens?

Regards,
DosDawg
CodeSatori
And remember, I didn't say talking about vegetarianism and all things related was necessarily business savvy -- that remains yet to be seen.

Little chats like this can have a thousand effects good and bad, and trust me I've seen and participated in dozens of threads like this in the past, and seen a great many take the royal road to hell.
DosDawg
you have been a true diplomat, not swaying one way or producing your beliefs as something that should be adapted by all who read the post. much respect to you.

Regards,
DosDawg
CodeSatori
Thanks DosDawg! My extended explorations with religious, spiritual etc. themes have turned me a hard-boiled individualist. There are countless possible points of view, yet none of them a TOE that would explain everything to everyone's satisfaction.

Let a thousand flowers bloom, and let's try to plant each flower in the right environment, too. I'm not sure Boonex blogs is the best avenue for discussing or advancing ideological aims, but Andrew has a right to give it a shot if he wants. He's done see more a lot of hard work to develop Boonex into what it is, and if he sees it as an extension of his mission in life, I personally don't care if my software is beef or carrot flavor as long as it works.
Technoman
First of all being a vegetarian is a dietary choice!

Towards anyone who is a broccoli-head!

If you don't like the smell of burning meat, well then get off the planet, I love beef and so do millions of others, so deal with it!

I'll be damned if I let somebody else push their broccoli-head on me!


Andrey.. I don't go around promoting beef and shoving it in people's faces on here, maybe the beef lovers should start a new blog on here, then Andrey will delete it perhaps ?

This is a see more Blog Software Discussion board not dietary!
Andrew Boon
Re-quote:

"There's only that much impact that your reasons to come here have on how this place should be shaped. You're here for software, so you can find it here. But there's more to the place, and some people, including myself want it to be so, and if it's not so, want it to become so."
I have kids.

I have grand kids.

I have emotions, feelings and thoughts of my own.

I seem to have read entirely different meaning from "Matt said No".

It was stated that there were two calves in the field owned by a beautiful person who was ill that Julia evidently identified with and cared about. Some one whom she had compassion and respect for and looked up to as a friend and fellow human being stumbling down the road of life.

Matt and the calf he named "Mumunia" see more seemed to have an immediate connection, a bonding, an attraction to each other. Positive Vibes instantly flowed freely between them.

There is no further mention of the second calf and the story focuses on the immediate bonding between Mumunia and Matty.

I have had that kind of bonding with animals and people (especially babies) and I cherish those moments that come along quite unexpectedly when two beings share a definite connection. I can identify with the positive vibes and unspoken communication of love and respect that pass between them.

A very special feeling that seems to happen more with children than adults because children are more receptive, innocent and their minds are not cluttered with the stress of every day life and myriads of thoughts and worries that flood an adult's mind.

Children have not yet learned to worry about taxes, dolphin bugs, deadlines, schedules or the morality of eating little handy sausages.

Mumunia and Matty are friends brought together by chance. They enjoyed each other's company for a time and missed each other when their time was up because they shared that special bonding.

A bonding that evidently didn't include the second calf.

Andrew, I think you are right about children "knowing what is right" and then adults come along and screw up the childrens' minds and teach them to be people they might not become on their own.

This doesn't pertain only to vegetarianism or personal choices, but to their ability to be open minded and perceptive of the vibes around them.

Young children are accepting of other ideas.

They are in awe of everything around them and they absorb this wondrous world with out prejudice or question. They are positive beings who look for similarities and thrive on the love and goodness of the world.

They have to learn negative thought processes like guilt, envy, jealousy or other vices.

Matty, would you want to eat Mumunia? NO!

Of course not. Mumunia is Matty's friend!

For Matty the question didn't conjure up visions of handy little sausages or heated debates over the virtues of vegetarian life versus eating meat.

Matty loves Mumunia unconditionally.

He doesn't need a reason, it just happened naturally.

Any other inferences conjured up by his answer of "No!" are purely our own adult minds extrapolating what we think he meant.

We here at Unity need to take a lesson from Matty.

We need to learn to have an open mind and learn to be in awe of the world around us. To remove the clutter of worry, and debate from our minds.

No need to translate the love of a boy for his new calf friend into any philosophical analogy of the meaning of life.

I have Native American Chickamaugua Cherokee blood (Paint Clan) running through my veins as well as many other European nationalities.

Cherokee People eat meat. They farm. They gather from the woods. They know medicinal plants and roots and tree barks. They live at one with mother nature.

Cherokee do not believe in killing any thing unless you ask it's permission and bless it first. Cherokee people believe that everything in mother nature is sacred.

My Cherokee grandmother lived to be 94 years old, she was a vegetarian and lived a long happy life, but most of all she was a beautiful person who did not judge others harshly, she had no underlying agendas or dramas in her life.

The one thing about my grandmother that remains first and foremost in my mind was her ability to love unconditionally.

She possessed what Matty possesses: She had the ability at 94 to have an open mind and heart and be receptive to all of the positive things around her.

I admire Matty's ability to be at one with a little calf.

Matty is the poster child for what I think Unity should be all about. Positive open and accepting.

I hope no adult changes him unintentionally by trying to translate his innocence into some complicated formula for life.

We all need to calm ourselves and rid our minds of all of this extraneous bullshit going through this post and become like Matty.

Who knows what "Mumunia" we might be missing in our lives while we set arguing?
Read the blog briefly and this is kinda like a political conversation,,,No one is right and no one is wrong..It is based on the environment we grew up in, each is different...I personally like a nice rack of ribs glazed with BBQ sauce and a cold 22oz beer..If I wanted to oppose the views of vegetarians, I could simply ask them "Why do you eat something that had life also?" Plants grow just like animals do but in a different way..See, it would be a never ending discussion with different see more points of views...There is nothing wrong with being a vegetarian and nothing wrong with eating a nice thick grilled steak cooked medium well with A1 steak sauce, mashed potatoes & some beer on a sunny Sunday. ....(Yummy!!)
Andrew Boon
I think Dwain has said it all. I, for one, after his comment see no reason why we should continue this discussion here. We can go rounds and rounds. There's plenty of information for everyone to consider while we go on living our lives.

Be happy people.
Just thought this might shed some light......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXDvIqD9wQc
DeeEmm
I abstained from posting when I first saw this post, I think i was a little shocked to see such an obviously non-tech topic here. The posting rules also crossed my mind, and I will say that I was surprised that given the fiore in the blogs a little while back there was not some application of 'lead by example'. But - when it is your own site - I guess you can post what you like.

Regarding the great meat / veggie debate - I can take it or leave it. My partner is vegetarian, and i rarely eat it see more simply as it is more convenient to only have to prepare one meal- For my partner - there is no moral reason - she simply doesn't like the taste of it.

Regarding the arguments for homo-sapiens being herbivorous, this is simply untrue. We are omnivorous - by nature we are hunter gatherers. This has long been proven and can be seen in many pre-cultural and pre-historic cave paintings - dating from times when homo-sapiens were but a relatively new species. Paintings also made by our other predecessors also echoes this.

In my mind, the problem is not one of eating meat, or killing to eat - but is simply wastage. Unoboonex touched on this with his comments on consumerism, KFC, Macdonalds etc, even our trusty supermarkets achieve the same - they dumb down the whole issue. As consumers we simply do not appreciate that there is so much wastage and so much unnecessary slaughter. I have long held the view that if everyone had to hunt / keep / kill their own dinner (as many of us did, not so long ago) then there would be much less wastage. Unnecessary killing is a bad thing, and it is driven by the disposable society we live in.

How many of us still use butchers? How many of our children have ever been to one? Do they even appreciate the connection between, their burger and the carcasses hanging in the butchers window? Supermarkets just package everything in a nicely presented styrofoam container with a pretty picture of a serving suggestion on it.

Regarding what to teach our children. I am a strong believer in letting them make their own minds up - knowledge is key - educate them by letting them know how food feeds society, why crops are farmed, cattle herded, and why we have been doing this for thousands of years. Let them know where their burgers come from, and give them the choice to make their own minds up.

To tell them it is wrong, is wrong in itself. As mickyb stated - there is no right or wrong answers - You cannot teach a child the answer to something it doesn't understand - especially if it contradicts it's own perceptions. This is the danger of trying to teach a child to adopt your views, especially in regards to something that is in essence has no right or wrong answer.

DM.
bizzi
You know the argument about meat and vegies?
Vegetables are a product of nature and are living things.. like cows are a product nature and are living things.... really... how can you be against eating one but not the other? Cows die, plants die, when you give plants affection they grow better when you give cows affection they grow better too. Their are tons of studies to back that up....

I know this will get deleted like all my posts....

I find it funny that everyone makes a big stink about see more eating meat... so much they boycott companies etc..
But when it comes to war (One man killing another for oil) Or things like that people don't say nuthing.. instead they quable over what is the right food to eat and what is not. Or if cows are food or your friend...

I love plants and nature, we have a green house the works... DON"T EAT VEGTABLES... it's cruel,

I am not making fun of anyone... I am just saying think about it... Both are living beings but one is better to kill and eat then the other? How do you know plants don't feel pain when you harvest them? You don't.

Man could you imagine if people put the same effort into caring about the world around them as they do about eating meat, or being gay, it just goes on...

Thanks for reminding me why I should not read blogs or really anything that is not about code or technology...

I tell you if I was starving and veggies was too expensive to buy but I could buy meat.. well I am gonna choose to eat meat. Where I am from vegetables are so expensive for what you pay for a weeks worth of vegi food I could eat meat for a month.

Ah to be rich and worry about such dumb things must be nice.

Now this is where you give me thumbs down and delete my post for having a mind of my own.
Food is food.... and if you were starving you would eat what ever was put in front of you or die of starvation....

Man people should boycott the wars and make blogs about how killing one another over crap that pollutes the air and is making us all sick anyways is wrong..
Oh wait their is.. but no one cares...

But people care about eating meat or vegetables...

((Shakes his head and takes a bite of his flame broiled double cheezeburger with vegies))
bizzi
Thanks for deleting my post... you sure are a pathetic bunch of Nazi.. And that's it for me.. with this boonex site... I'll make sure on my MASSIVLY viewed tech site to do a review of the software and community here. I was gonna wait till Beta was done before doing my review but there is just no point.

Now excuse me while I delete my account and trash your software on my review. And if you happen to hear about a really bad review of your software and community check it out.. and if I was the one see more who wrote it...

:)
.. you will know.

Cheers...

And before you say a word about my credibility...
the name Bizzi is just a name I use when I plan to be a dick.

My normal name.. don't matter.. as it's not important. It's the 200 000 views a month on my tech site that matters...

Dol script & community = Epic Fail.

I will be sure to make mention of how easy your software can be infected with bugs and how anyone using your software should think twice... not only would they have to put up with this community and the non-stop glitching script but if they should choose to partake in any discussion I will be sure to inform them to kiss ass... or get dumped on...

Good luck with your dating sites..
Kinda sad when you think about it... What kinda loser goes to a site to look for a hook up?
Ah the same kinda loser who thinks they can make a buck off of losers looking for love on a website...

man you guys were a hoot, thanks for the laughs... it's about all this site and software was ever good for...
 
 
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