Censorship

DeeEmm posted 18th of May 2010 in Community Voice. 22 comments.

Different cultures and countries have different considerations to freedom of speech. America have their first amendment, in the UK we have the bill of rights, globally there is the declaration of human rights. All of these express the right to freedom of opinion and expression, however, some countries exercise censorship - such as the internet censorship by Thailand, who have very strict rules against pornography and sites that are offensive to their king.

Traditionally censorship is not seen as a positive thing, oppression of knowledge via censorship goes back millennia, it is often considered that the great library of Alexander was burned to prevent the knowledge passing on, as were all pagan texts as they did not fit with the new christian religion, or in fact, any opposing religions - The stories of censorship, whilst different are usually all of a similar theme. In more recent times censorship was extensively carried out in the eastern bloc countries, as a tool of control by Stalin, and used for repressive means in suppressing nationalist activities.

The home of Boonex. Kyrgyzstan, is one such a place that fell under the control of Stalin and experienced this first hand.

It surprised me to find that given the oppressive nature of censorship, posts that I have made, have been edited and censored here on Unity, and particularly in a blog - a place where discourse is the main idea. What is the point of having a conversation if you are simply going to delete all of the answers that you do not like?

I am especially surprised as this has also been done by someone who promotes Unity / freedom / community / etc and is someone who has likely experienced first hand the oppressive nature of censorship and repression in Kyrgyzstan.

Andrew. Clearly my view upsets you to the extent that you feel that the only option is to delete my posts. But consider - that this actually says a lot more about you than it does about me. It also defines that there is a truth in what I say, or you would simply refute it with discourse.

Censorship is for cowards (or communist dictators). You would do well to remember Glasnost and Perestroika?.

My posts were neither rude, not offensive, nor were they particularly sharp in tone. The only thing that they did, was to disagree with you, and impart my opinion, an opinion it seems that many share. Whilst I know and appreciate that it is your right as site owner to do as you please, I find it cowardly and shallow that you should delete the post rather than stand up to it.

Be a man - accept criticism as it comes to you. Your critics are the ones that you should be taking notice of - those who critique your work and software have taken the time to get to know it intimately enough to be able to discern the values associated with it - whether good or bad. Those who simply agree and pat you on the back and say 'good job', are of little value to you whatsoever, except for bolstering the ego.

It is the critics who really set what things are of value - food critics, movie critics, book critics, art, music, drama science and software critics. It is the critics you should start to listen to - and not just the noisy ones like me - go take a look at the points for the posts relating to your latest round of 'ideas'. Still think they are a good idea? If you do, then I think that you have been blinded by your own brilliance.

As I said to Alex in my Blog post - When there is nothing left to criticise - your job is done.


/DM

 
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tyke
I think you have been here long enough DeeEmm to realise you are waisting your time with posts like these... Its very obvious to me when reading your complaints, that you indeed know what your talking about, and the valid points you make, make other people look like amateurs (cleverly worded that to not point fingers) :-)
Course the powers that be aint gunna like that, so one of two things will happen, you will either be told to shut up and stop being discouraging to other users, or you will simply see more be deleted...

Truth is, when its like that, there's not a lot you can do, but it does show that the people telling you to shut up, or simply deleting your posts, dont actually have a valid argument against you, so the easy course is to shut you up..

welcome to boonex UNITY (ROFL)

regards

Tyke
CodeSatori
One thing I hate more than most things online is when someone deletes a well thought-out post, and the issues in it remain unaddressed. We all value our time, and if someone decides to delete 15 minutes of my day for a reason I consider wholly unwarranted, I resent it. I have no reason to believe DeeEmm would be any different in this regard.

If the issues have been addressed elsewhere in sufficient detail, just provide links to the earlier responses. If they haven't, then perhaps they should. see more And if there are issues at Boonex that are taboo to discuss, then they should also be clearly stated as such (and perhaps with a little rationale to go along as a cherry on the top).

And if the taboo scenario is a fact of life here, then maybe we can have an exhaustive list of banned topics so we know to avoid them. =)
DosDawg
Guys,
i have no idea what was deleted here, but i have heard of posts being deleted that were not favorable to the boonex environment. As a moderator, i have hidden posts on here, as we have no authority to 'delete' anything. the notice is sent to the site admins to investigate the post, and at their discretion let the post remain hidden, or unhide the post. I have in fact hidden a post from Andrew, since the rules state this should be a blog in reference to your experience with the dolphin platform, see more and he had written on a topic that was controversial in nature, and was causing discontent amongst the members.

The post was reinstated, and I was scolded for hiding it, and informed that the boonex staff does not have to adhere to any of the rules laid out.

I do believe that many times there are posts that are removed from here that should be allowed to be public, when its the truth, and conducive to a better product, no matter how much the sting. As any of you may well know, most of the posts i have written, at some level cause an uproar. I bring the truth, and in doing so I have also been accused of not knowing what i was talking about. Once instance of this was with the Softaculous tout, how great it was and considering having softaculous worthy of a front and center blog post about which affiliate for boonex has enabled softaculous.

I seldom post something that is not considered true and honest, and in being from the US I understand the Freedom of Speech as it is written, however, with any freedom there are consequences positive or negative, there is a consequence.

At any rate, DEE, sorry to hear you had to spend your time writing such a post as this. I would tend to think it wont get any better, as negativity breeds negativity. In understanding communism and censorship, it would be adverse to consider that one who grew up in that manner of control, would also feel it adequate to extend that same control in their lives.

Regards,
DosDawg
jtadeo
@DeeEm

re:"As I said to Alex in my Blog post - When there is nothing left to criticise - your job is done."

100%

...sip...
Nathan Paton
I hate to admit it, but you are very much correct (not so much on facts of the world, but the general idea here is quite solid).
cbassthefish
@ Magnussoft. Was there an incorrect fact you spotted? Please do tell :o) Only out of interest that is :o) Might come in handy in a game of Trivial Pursuit. Having said that, the last time I played TP was 11 years ago.
danielmarseille
you are not the first -
since I'm here - it is now three years - from time to time there is censorship - on some negative messages - both on blogs and forums

you said: "I am particularly surprised that this has been done by someone who promotes unity / free / community / etc"
Unfortunately, I think these words are nothing more than marketing
houstonlively
DM, don't take this personally, but you have a tendency to insult people when you point out things that are screwed up. I'm not going to chastise you for it, because I've been guilty of the same thing on numerous occasions.

There is no freedom of speech, when you are sitting at someone else's table.

From your other recent blog post:

Tags: deeemm, dolphin, upgrade, dolphin7, will, break, your, site, rankings, dolphin6, what, joke, seo what a joke, seo


Some select adjectives:

WTF??? see more WHY?????????

absolute stupidity

the coders are complete amateurs.

it is done out of sheer stupidity.

I never got to see the post of yours that got 'censored', but it it was anything like your 'is a joke' blog, you might want to try a more diplomatic approach next time. Hell... some day I might even take my own advice and do the same thing.
CodeSatori
Maybe Andrew could sponsor an insult management course for select Unity members? (To complement the communications seminar that the staff need to take.) Or maybe you guys should just leave segments of your output for sharing at Sooperstars.
Andrew Boon
I never remove posts that just disagree with my points of view or criticise me. If, however, a post is filled with insulting phrases just to wind off somebody's crappy morning, I have no business cleaning things out, I just delete it.

Take "the coders are complete amateurs." and "it is done out of sheer stupidity." - this is NOT a disagreement or critique, this is just slander, and your freedom of speech is the last thing I care about in this case.
Profesize
@DEE

Look on the bright side mate.............at least you know your blogs or posts are not being ignored or left unanswered. I wish Andrew would delete at least one of my posts cause at least I'd know he read it...

.............................you're so lucky!! lol
rhimpr
Oh boy.... The post wasn't that bad and there was some good business advice in there for you... I would have taking it as constructive criticism....
buckmcgoo
Don't say anything bad about a Boonex backed webhost or a programmer selling other peoples mods or your post will be deleted so fast your head will spin.
DeeEmm
@HL - yes I agree, some may take offense to my words, but they are mostly aimed at Boonex the corporate entity, the "system" if you like, and so are not really intended to offend anyone. I have no personal vendetta or agenda here - in reality my comments probably only really serve to hinder my endeavors with Dolphin. I rarely attack anyone directly intentionally, this generally only happens if i am provoked.

Sometimes, things simply need to be said.

@Andrew - There were no insults see more in the posts that you deleted, they simply struck a nerve. As I said before - this actually says a lot more about you, than you care to realise. And whilst it may no longer be available for others to read, the most ironic thing is, that pretty much all of what I said in the deleted posts, has since been said by others. All you have really succeeded in doing, by deleting my posts, is turning up the volume.

/DM
houstonlively
You don't think calling a group of people complete amateurs, and labeling their endeavors sheer stupidity, is insulting?
CodeSatori
There's always someone who will say that if the shoe fits, it's not a real insult but just a (remarkably) unpleasant statement of a truth.

I don't know if DeeEmm actually meant it literally. If he did, he would do well to either demonstrate it (constructively please – we do want everyone to learn), or keep from saying it out loud.
DeeEmm
It is only insulting if it is not true, otherwise it is simply an observation.

The word stupid is insulting if it insinuates a lack of cognitive ability, but in the context it was written it means a lack of understanding - This is clear and easy to deduce. Anybody who understands SEO and the relationship that changing the URL structure has on it, understands that changing the URL's to the extent done here is a absolute no-no. Therefore it implies a lack of understanding - one of the literal definitions see more for "stupid"

Not sure if you've read that particular blog since, but the situation is actually worse than i first reported. The mod_rewrite hacks that Andrew and Alex sited as the fix do not actually work - nor can the issue be fixed. The rewrite rules only apply to the pages that the images are placed on - not the images themselves - where the change to both the location and image names, mean that there is no way to write a redirect rule to remedy the issue...

[insert own judgement here]

Anyway - back on topic...

The word professional (antonym for amateur) traditionally means someone of degree level education, and generally means someone who makes a living from their work and typically has formal training and certifications relating to it. It also implies a certain level of expert and specialized knowledge in the field which one is practicing. So, again, in relationship to the context in which amateur was said. The layout of the code, it's structure and operation, is not written to any recognizable standard that I am familiar with, nor does it follow generally accepted best practice methods. It is therefore, not the apparent work of a professional.

cont...
DeeEmm
Being a professional software engineer myself (by the definition given above), and running my own software company (not just the DeeEmm Web Technologies that you may be familiar with) I am actually qualified to make this judgment. This is my professional opinion. I have actually sacked softies for writing BETTER code than this.

With reference to to 'no freedom of speech at some else table" - a nice metaphor, but alas not true if you choose to put your table in the middle of a public forum, see more and invite public opinion.

Also with reference to "slander" - as mentioned by Andrew. Published content is actually referred to as libel, slander is in fact 'spoken word'.

As far as individuals within the "system" taking offense to my words. This is commonly known as a guilty reaction, and means that my comments here are worthwhile.

/DM
tyke
What is it some people say "the proof is in the pudding", and i think in this case the pudding has gone stale.... Ive been here some time now, and ive noticed (like you would have to be blind deaf and stupid not to notice) but this place is sinking fast... Apart from a few people who are hanging about propping this place up, for reasons best known to themselves, this site is almost dead. Ive never known it so quiet, in the blogs, and the forums aren't much better, apart from the newbies see more crying out for help because it all didn't all work out the way the promo video said it would. :-)
People might not say out loud what DeeEmm is saying, but it seems obvious to me that a fair few are thinking it, and losing interest in this thing ever working.
Given the situation here, im surprised (being an understatement) to see other projects being started like that stupid reverse twitter, and that other thing, webcobblers.org or whatever its called, rather than all the attention being focused on getting D7 working like it should.
It does bother me i must admit, people are sat waiting, and then waiting some more to be able to use it on a live site without issue, spending money on hosting and so on, and losing faith in the software. The only people being caught in the net now are people believing that promo video which is soooo full of holes that when they get their hands on the software and work with it for a bit, they are moving on to something else, because they just haven't got the time to sort out the mess.
It also bothers me, that the starting of these other two new projects mentioned above, also gives the impression that boonex themselves have lost interest in D7, and given the state of the actual coding, it does seem like it has got out of control, become too complex for the team to sort out. Which is why its gone stale, and on top of that, still no documentation to speak of, no real support, no real interest, and only half a product...
tyke
Its easy to see why a professional software engineer would point out glaringly obvious faults in the system, and me, as a wannabe end user, can see the faults in the whole system (like falling into the grand canyon) you really cant miss them...
CodeSatori
@DeeEmm: Now we're talking.

The SEO issues you brought up can cause substantial damage to a site's ranking and status, and as such certainly doesn't fall under "professional" -- and I think being incensed over it is justified. Don't even get me started on the code... A great deal of it looks like it was designed by space aliens on acid. There's clearly skill there, but it's a riot in terms of coding logic.

Notice I didn't say "amateur", I said "space aliens", see more and I didn't say "stupid", I said "on acid". (The truth is out there -- I want to believe!!)

I've been willing to give the benefit of doubt for the developers under the assumption that they are extremely busy and stuck with an old and overblown system. However, Andrew has noted that Boonex is already spending $500,000 per annum for Dolphin development, and are not in need of more developers, so I'm a tad bit baffled over how all this works out.

I have to say though that I don't envy Alex (or whoever the coding manager is), stuck between the fire and the frying pan (either deal with the whole jumble, or start completely from a scratch). I would just start from a scratch.

I guess at times like this you need to blame the "system". (Then again you may want to extend the blame to those who don't care to change the system and make it better. Go figure.)
 
 
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